ISIS Strikes Deal With Moderate Syrian Rebels that Obama wanted to support.
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look at the end of the day Isis has to be destroyed and seemingly we are the only ones willing and capable to do it. all this talk about our history in the mid east is nonsense. it is what it is and we have to deal with it
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FuriousOne wrote: »That's not how War works at all. You aren't going anywhere because soon as you leave, someone else takes over. America stayed in Germany and Japan for years after they were defeated to insure that their success remains. The only way around that is to do what was done in Iran, install a puppet leader but make sure he has the same infrastructure you built. Easier said then done as evidenced by the overthrow. Even then, after hundreds of years of rule, you may get something like what happened in Scotland where people still desire independence.
Yeah, I know. I was hoping that my "Though this is all much easier said than done" conveyed that. If I'm not mistaken, we still have "troops" in Germany and Japan. I'm actually against the wars though.
I still disagree to a small extent though. If the United States effected a non-interventionist policy (which, as it stands today, will not), then we could literally pull out completely after winning a war. The problem lies in what are objective would be. If our objective was to exploit the region for profit (and I believe that this is mostly the case), then pulling out completely would be impossible. However, if our objective was to, say, capture and try an international terrorist (e.g. Osama bin Laden and the original intent for the war in Afghanistan), then I don't see any reason why we can't capture or ? the terrorist (or depose him if he's a national leader) and then completely pull out...
Well, now that I think about it, I think that you're exactly right. Even if we take out an international terrorist, we'd still have to take out his buddies and secure the area because if we pull out, someone else will take his place and do the same thing, which would force us to go back and take care of business, and the cycle continues.
My bottom line is that I'm against the wars because they're not justifiable (among other things) and therefore shouldn't be fought for. The best alternative to war is to avoid it altogether, but we have provoked it and made it worse. For over half a century, our foreign policy has created the anti-American sentiment that has caused these groups to attack us. We need to fix our foreign policy in order to stop the cycle of war.FuriousOne wrote: »They were part of England in overall good standing long enough to convince some that that was too much of a dramatic rule even though they do seek more autonomy. The only way to win a war in the Middle east, is to affect the majority culturally and you have to be around to do that. Still, a minority just may have enough ? to shift control like Saddam did when he first came to power. The bottom line to me is, they attacked our land and have a chance to do it again. People claim America incited them, but Muslims have been conquering lands to spread their influence for centuries so i don't trust that they would leave us alone if we left them alone. See Africa for example.
But America has incited them! And "them" and "Muslims" seem like pretty big generalizations. And the world has changed a lot since Muhammad's days. Iran is a Muslim country, and I've heard that it hasn't invaded a country in the last 150 years. Yet, for the past decade, we've treated Iran like it was Soviet Russia, which had a thousand nuclear weapons. Like Iraq's nonexistent WMDs, Iran still doesn't have one nuclear weapon.
because we are dealing with religiously motivated fighters the only way to stop the cycle of wars is with their total defeat and humiliation. or our complete withdrawal. the former takes lots of blood and money the later is out of the question because it creates more potential problems. -
FuriousOne wrote: »That's not how War works at all. You aren't going anywhere because soon as you leave, someone else takes over. America stayed in Germany and Japan for years after they were defeated to insure that their success remains. The only way around that is to do what was done in Iran, install a puppet leader but make sure he has the same infrastructure you built. Easier said then done as evidenced by the overthrow. Even then, after hundreds of years of rule, you may get something like what happened in Scotland where people still desire independence.
Yeah, I know. I was hoping that my "Though this is all much easier said than done" conveyed that. If I'm not mistaken, we still have "troops" in Germany and Japan. I'm actually against the wars though.
I still disagree to a small extent though. If the United States effected a non-interventionist policy (which, as it stands today, will not), then we could literally pull out completely after winning a war. The problem lies in what are objective would be. If our objective was to exploit the region for profit (and I believe that this is mostly the case), then pulling out completely would be impossible. However, if our objective was to, say, capture and try an international terrorist (e.g. Osama bin Laden and the original intent for the war in Afghanistan), then I don't see any reason why we can't capture or ? the terrorist (or depose him if he's a national leader) and then completely pull out...
Well, now that I think about it, I think that you're exactly right. Even if we take out an international terrorist, we'd still have to take out his buddies and secure the area because if we pull out, someone else will take his place and do the same thing, which would force us to go back and take care of business, and the cycle continues.
My bottom line is that I'm against the wars because they're not justifiable (among other things) and therefore shouldn't be fought for. The best alternative to war is to avoid it altogether, but we have provoked it and made it worse. For over half a century, our foreign policy has created the anti-American sentiment that has caused these groups to attack us. We need to fix our foreign policy in order to stop the cycle of war.FuriousOne wrote: »They were part of England in overall good standing long enough to convince some that that was too much of a dramatic rule even though they do seek more autonomy. The only way to win a war in the Middle east, is to affect the majority culturally and you have to be around to do that. Still, a minority just may have enough ? to shift control like Saddam did when he first came to power. The bottom line to me is, they attacked our land and have a chance to do it again. People claim America incited them, but Muslims have been conquering lands to spread their influence for centuries so i don't trust that they would leave us alone if we left them alone. See Africa for example.
But America has incited them! And "them" and "Muslims" seem like pretty big generalizations. And the world has changed a lot since Muhammad's days. Iran is a Muslim country, and I've heard that it hasn't invaded a country in the last 150 years. Yet, for the past decade, we've treated Iran like it was Soviet Russia, which had a thousand nuclear weapons. Like Iraq's nonexistent WMDs, Iran still doesn't have one nuclear weapon.
because we are dealing with religiously motivated fighters the only way to stop the cycle of wars is with their total defeat and humiliation. or our complete withdrawal. the former takes lots of blood and money the later is out of the question because it creates more potential problems.
This isn't a job for America to do. Babysitting the Middle East isn't America's job,our job is to protect our borders and make sure the homeland is safe. Getting involved in a civil war half a world away will only create more enemies for America, read what intelligence officials are saying all over the world. Out of all the bad choices, getting involved is the worst one. ISIS recruitment is increasing ever since America got involved,but I guess you want ISIS to grow in numbers. -
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i an going to submit that people saying this based on many, many varied conspiracies that say things like "the CIA trained UBL" or "we armed the Taliban"kingblaze84 wrote: »Okay I hear your clarification. So we on the same page on the American and 1980s mujahedeen situation. The reason some people say America gave Osama and the mujahedeen direct support is because CIA and other agencies knew Islamists were getting all these weapons from Pakistan and other front nations.
keep in mind, though, that you're stating it as a reason for the US to not get involved, as if 'Russia has it covered,' as opposed to just "people shouldn't be doing this kind of thing"kingblaze84 wrote: »As far as Russia working against ISIS, I merely am responding to the people who are saying America must do more, when 3 nations are already working against them. Whether the Russians SHOULD do this is a whole other issue.
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i an going to submit that people saying this based on many, many varied conspiracies that say things like "the CIA trained UBL" or "we armed the Taliban"kingblaze84 wrote: »Okay I hear your clarification. So we on the same page on the American and 1980s mujahedeen situation. The reason some people say America gave Osama and the mujahedeen direct support is because CIA and other agencies knew Islamists were getting all these weapons from Pakistan and other front nations.
keep in mind, though, that you're stating it as a reason for the US to not get involved, as if 'Russia has it covered,' as opposed to just "people shouldn't be doing this kind of thing"kingblaze84 wrote: »As far as Russia working against ISIS, I merely am responding to the people who are saying America must do more, when 3 nations are already working against them. Whether the Russians SHOULD do this is a whole other issue.
Considering how close Russia is to Asia (some parts of Russia are in Asia), I don't blame Russia too much for getting involved. Russia doesn't have a great history in the Middle East, but it still is quite close to Iraq and Syria. Russia is also allies of Syrian president Assad AND the Iraqi president, but notice Russians themselves aren't doing the bombing so far. It's because they are sensitive to its history of the brutal campaign in Afghanistan back in the 80s.
I really don't mind outside nations backing up their allies or whatever, I just don't want America aka the Great Satan to get involved. America's reputation in that part of the world is tarnished because of our horrible support for Israel's evil govt, and other things American govt has done in that region, so it's best for America to stay out of this mess for now. Sadly it may be too late for that........ -
kingblaze84 wrote: »
i an going to submit that people saying this based on many, many varied conspiracies that say things like "the CIA trained UBL" or "we armed the Taliban"kingblaze84 wrote: »Okay I hear your clarification. So we on the same page on the American and 1980s mujahedeen situation. The reason some people say America gave Osama and the mujahedeen direct support is because CIA and other agencies knew Islamists were getting all these weapons from Pakistan and other front nations.
keep in mind, though, that you're stating it as a reason for the US to not get involved, as if 'Russia has it covered,' as opposed to just "people shouldn't be doing this kind of thing"kingblaze84 wrote: »As far as Russia working against ISIS, I merely am responding to the people who are saying America must do more, when 3 nations are already working against them. Whether the Russians SHOULD do this is a whole other issue.
Considering how close Russia is to Asia (some parts of Russia are in Asia), I don't blame Russia too much for getting involved. Russia doesn't have a great history in the Middle East, but it still is quite close to Iraq and Syria. Russia is also allies of Syrian president Assad AND the Iraqi president, but notice Russians themselves aren't doing the bombing so far. It's because they are sensitive to its history of the brutal campaign in Afghanistan back in the 80s.
I really don't mind outside nations backing up their allies or whatever, I just don't want America aka the Great Satan to get involved. America's reputation in that part of the world is tarnished because of our horrible support for Israel's evil govt, so it's best for America to stay out of this mess for now. Sadly it may be too late for that........
Our money is still good there. ? they feelings. They'll be alright and continue to ask for our support on the low with dealing with those backwards jihadists. Those ? aren't sensitive to the ? that went down in Afghanistan. They have no issue with bombing Ukraine. They trying to get money like everybody else. It's not like the Afghans stood a chance without American support against Russia. Russia still mad at us over that. We gonna do them ? in Ukraine too if they continue their saber rattling. If they were really friends with Iraq and Syria. They wouldn't be sitting on the side lines letting ISIS ? them up. -
Flames Of War by ISIS, full movie....after watching this, I'm convinced ISIS badly wants American troops back in Iraq and even Syria. It seems to say they will provoke Americans into sending ground troops soon. Obama sending in the air strikes has been the perfect propaganda tool for ISIS, what's funny is that the video itself admits this....good job Obama, good job Bush.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=S-P602KxblI -
kingblaze84 wrote: »Flames Of War by ISIS, full movie....after watching this, I'm convinced ISIS badly wants American troops back in Iraq and even Syria. It seems to say they will provoke Americans into sending ground troops soon. Obama sending in the air strikes has been the perfect propaganda tool for ISIS, what's funny is that the video itself admits this....good job Obama, good job Bush.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=S-P602KxblI
What's the point of you posting these propaganda pieces? So they predicted that America would bomb them if they massacred everybody in their path? Good on them. They will get what they want, but i don't see it working out for them exactly as they predicted. -
FuriousOne wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »Flames Of War by ISIS, full movie....after watching this, I'm convinced ISIS badly wants American troops back in Iraq and even Syria. It seems to say they will provoke Americans into sending ground troops soon. Obama sending in the air strikes has been the perfect propaganda tool for ISIS, what's funny is that the video itself admits this....good job Obama, good job Bush.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=S-P602KxblI
What's the point of you posting these propaganda pieces? So they predicted that America would bomb them if they massacred everybody in their path? Good on them. They will get what they want, but i don't see it working out for them exactly as they predicted.
I posted the video cuz I thought it was interesting, someone emailed it to me awhile ago. I agree ISIS will be very disappointed down the line, they're creating so many enemies they won't last too long. Then again, America will be disappointed fighting them as well, especially when we eventually send ground troops there. -
goldjordan wrote: »the only way to fix all these problems in the middle east is total invasion and total war followed by with a long term occupation. isis taking over syria would be a horror no one trust america over there so we can have no allies nor should we back anyone that is not under our direct control.
syria borders with israel and i don't think israel is going to stand for any of that ? if isis takes syria ? is going to get worse and the risk that it's only going to spread.
WORLD WAR THREE FOR PEACE
IT WON'T TAKE WW3 IF WE DON WHAT WE HAVE TO DO NOW. radical islam has to be totally eradicated and pushed into obscurity just like ? and maoism. -
goldjordan wrote: »the only way to fix all these problems in the middle east is total invasion and total war followed by with a long term occupation. isis taking over syria would be a horror no one trust america over there so we can have no allies nor should we back anyone that is not under our direct control.
syria borders with israel and i don't think israel is going to stand for any of that ? if isis takes syria ? is going to get worse and the risk that it's only going to spread.
WORLD WAR THREE FOR PEACE
IT WON'T TAKE WW3 IF WE DON WHAT WE HAVE TO DO NOW. radical islam has to be totally eradicated and pushed into obscurity just like ? and maoism.
Your idea of escalating the war is EXACTLY what ISIS wants. It's one of the reasons I posted the Flames of War movie earlier, ISIS WANTS American boots on the ground. It's great propaganda for them and a huge recruiting tool but you still don't see that. By the way, according to news reports, America has been bombing Syria for the past hour tonight. Allegedly, 25 air strikes have been hitting ISIS Syrian positions. Your dreams of a wider war in that region will come true sooner then you think. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »goldjordan wrote: »the only way to fix all these problems in the middle east is total invasion and total war followed by with a long term occupation. isis taking over syria would be a horror no one trust america over there so we can have no allies nor should we back anyone that is not under our direct control.
syria borders with israel and i don't think israel is going to stand for any of that ? if isis takes syria ? is going to get worse and the risk that it's only going to spread.
WORLD WAR THREE FOR PEACE
IT WON'T TAKE WW3 IF WE DON WHAT WE HAVE TO DO NOW. radical islam has to be totally eradicated and pushed into obscurity just like ? and maoism.
Your idea of escalating the war is EXACTLY what ISIS wants. It's one of the reasons I posted the Flames of War movie earlier, ISIS WANTS American boots on the ground. It's great propaganda for them and a huge recruiting tool but you still don't see that. By the way, according to news reports, America has been bombing Syria for the past hour tonight. Allegedly, 25 air strikes have been hitting ISIS Syrian positions. Your dreams of a wider war in that region will come true sooner then you think.
dog i don't care what isis wants, these people are religiously motivated, understand that, they think that allah is going to make them win no matter what happens. Therefore to obliterate this belief we have to fight them and totally destroy them.
let them KEEP recruiting as much as they want in the end it will only mean more dead isis members. our number one mistake has been in delaying the inevitable. in the middle east this barbaric version of islam that is really pure islam needs to be removed from the world. period. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »goldjordan wrote: »the only way to fix all these problems in the middle east is total invasion and total war followed by with a long term occupation. isis taking over syria would be a horror no one trust america over there so we can have no allies nor should we back anyone that is not under our direct control.
syria borders with israel and i don't think israel is going to stand for any of that ? if isis takes syria ? is going to get worse and the risk that it's only going to spread.
WORLD WAR THREE FOR PEACE
IT WON'T TAKE WW3 IF WE DON WHAT WE HAVE TO DO NOW. radical islam has to be totally eradicated and pushed into obscurity just like ? and maoism.
Your idea of escalating the war is EXACTLY what ISIS wants. It's one of the reasons I posted the Flames of War movie earlier, ISIS WANTS American boots on the ground. It's great propaganda for them and a huge recruiting tool but you still don't see that. By the way, according to news reports, America has been bombing Syria for the past hour tonight. Allegedly, 25 air strikes have been hitting ISIS Syrian positions. Your dreams of a wider war in that region will come true sooner then you think.
dog i don't care what isis wants, these people are religiously motivated, understand that, they think that allah is going to make them win no matter what happens. Therefore to obliterate this belief we have to fight them and totally destroy them.
let them KEEP recruiting as much as they want in the end it will only mean more dead isis members. our number one mistake has been in delaying the inevitable. in the middle east this barbaric version of islam that is really pure islam needs to be removed from the world. period.
ISIS is a religious group true but many of their allies are former members of Saddam's army and other less religious groups. Saddam was very secular, so for his former soldiers to join ISIS means this is more then just a religious thing. This is a mostly political problem, as even Americans have said. Of course, religious groups like ISIS are gaining members because they are beating their Shiite "oppressors", but as I said before, this is basically a Sunni-Shiite CIVIL WAR gone mad. If you want ISIS to KEEP recruiting easily, you are not thinking well at all. Do you realize how long a war this would be then? I forgot, you want America to open an empire in Iraq and lucky for you the MIC wants that too. There's too many oil companies and American contractor buildings to protect, question is how much is this gonna cost us? I hope Americans enjoy another trillion dollar war.
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How long till America sends in combat troops to Iraq or Syria? I give it two weeks.
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so your theory is you can meddle in things based strictly on proximity? also, i would submit that Russians aren't doing the bombings for reasons more complicated than "they're sensitive to the history of their Afghanistan campaign." they followed that campaign up with plenty of sensitivity in central Asia and eastern Europe.kingblaze84 wrote: »Considering how close Russia is to Asia (some parts of Russia are in Asia), I don't blame Russia too much for getting involved.
so Saudi Arabia, Jordan, etc ... they're America's allies, right? so did you just cosign America getting involved and then say you don't want America to get involved? because there's a slight problem there...kingblaze84 wrote: »I really don't mind outside nations backing up their allies or whatever, I just don't want America aka the Great Satan to get involved.
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well, that's certainly true. if nothing else, it lets them recruit and feel like big men for fighting AMERICA.kingblaze84 wrote: »...after watching this, I'm convinced ISIS badly wants American troops back in Iraq and even Syria.
all depends on what "combat troops" even means. could be we've sent them already.kingblaze84 wrote: »How long till America sends in combat troops to Iraq or Syria? I give it two weeks.
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U.S. Begins Airstrikes In Syria, Pentagon SaysThe U.S. and five Arab countries launched airstrikes Monday night on Islamic State group targets in Syria, expanding a military campaign into a country whose three-year civil war has given the brutal militant group a safe haven.
Using a mix of manned aircraft — fighter jets and bombers — plus Tomahawk cruise missiles, the strikes were part of the expanded military campaign that President Barack Obama authorized nearly two weeks ago in order to disrupt and destroy the Islamic State militants, who have slaughtered thousands of people, beheaded Westerners — including two American journalists — and captured large swaths of Syria and northern and western Iraq.
U.S. officials said the airstrikes began around 8:30 p.m. EDT, and were conducted by the U.S., Bahrain, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Jordan and the United Arab Emirates. The first wave of strikes finished about 90 minutes later, but the operation was expected to continue for several more hours, according to one U.S. official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak publicly by name about an ongoing mission.
? Russia. Let's get it.
Take that, Take that, Take that.
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kingblaze84 wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »goldjordan wrote: »the only way to fix all these problems in the middle east is total invasion and total war followed by with a long term occupation. isis taking over syria would be a horror no one trust america over there so we can have no allies nor should we back anyone that is not under our direct control.
syria borders with israel and i don't think israel is going to stand for any of that ? if isis takes syria ? is going to get worse and the risk that it's only going to spread.
WORLD WAR THREE FOR PEACE
IT WON'T TAKE WW3 IF WE DON WHAT WE HAVE TO DO NOW. radical islam has to be totally eradicated and pushed into obscurity just like ? and maoism.
Your idea of escalating the war is EXACTLY what ISIS wants. It's one of the reasons I posted the Flames of War movie earlier, ISIS WANTS American boots on the ground. It's great propaganda for them and a huge recruiting tool but you still don't see that. By the way, according to news reports, America has been bombing Syria for the past hour tonight. Allegedly, 25 air strikes have been hitting ISIS Syrian positions. Your dreams of a wider war in that region will come true sooner then you think.
dog i don't care what isis wants, these people are religiously motivated, understand that, they think that allah is going to make them win no matter what happens. Therefore to obliterate this belief we have to fight them and totally destroy them.
let them KEEP recruiting as much as they want in the end it will only mean more dead isis members. our number one mistake has been in delaying the inevitable. in the middle east this barbaric version of islam that is really pure islam needs to be removed from the world. period.
ISIS is a religious group true but many of their allies are former members of Saddam's army and other less religious groups. Saddam was very secular, so for his former soldiers to join ISIS means this is more then just a religious thing. This is a mostly political problem, as even Americans have said. Of course, religious groups like ISIS are gaining members because they are beating their Shiite "oppressors", but as I said before, this is basically a Sunni-Shiite CIVIL WAR gone mad. If you want ISIS to KEEP recruiting easily, you are not thinking well at all. Do you realize how long a war this would be then? I forgot, you want America to open an empire in Iraq and lucky for you the MIC wants that too. There's too many oil companies and American contractor buildings to protect, question is how much is this gonna cost us? I hope Americans enjoy another trillion dollar war.
just because saddam was secular that does not mean his soliders were also, and i don't want isis to keep gaining members i just don't care if they do or not because it's largely unimportant if they do or not. They lack the firepower technologically and logistically to really go to war with a real nation that has real fighters. And a war against isiS right now would not last very long at all, within a month they would be falling back to using sneak attacks and hidden bombs. i want america to govern certain nations in the middle east the same way we did japan after ww2 leaving iraq so soon was a mistake.
with islam there is no political problems religious problems and political problems are the same thing if america follows your isolationist policy instead of fighting a trillion dollar war now we will fight a ten trillion dollar war 15 years from now. -
so your theory is you can meddle in things based strictly on proximity? also, i would submit that Russians aren't doing the bombings for reasons more complicated than "they're sensitive to the history of their Afghanistan campaign." they followed that campaign up with plenty of sensitivity in central Asia and eastern Europe.kingblaze84 wrote: »Considering how close Russia is to Asia (some parts of Russia are in Asia), I don't blame Russia too much for getting involved.
so Saudi Arabia, Jordan, etc ... they're America's allies, right? so did you just cosign America getting involved and then say you don't want America to get involved? because there's a slight problem there...kingblaze84 wrote: »I really don't mind outside nations backing up their allies or whatever, I just don't want America aka the Great Satan to get involved.
Well as I said before, I don't want America getting involved. It will build more recruitment for ISIS and Khorosan (new Al-Qaeda affiliated group), making a generational, long war more likely and expensive. Saudi Arabia and the rest could have done these air strikes with their own people but when ISIS recruitment turns into an avalanche, I hope people don't act all surprised when things get worse and worse. Mark my words, America will regret this the same exact way Americans now regret taking out Saddam. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »goldjordan wrote: »the only way to fix all these problems in the middle east is total invasion and total war followed by with a long term occupation. isis taking over syria would be a horror no one trust america over there so we can have no allies nor should we back anyone that is not under our direct control.
syria borders with israel and i don't think israel is going to stand for any of that ? if isis takes syria ? is going to get worse and the risk that it's only going to spread.
WORLD WAR THREE FOR PEACE
IT WON'T TAKE WW3 IF WE DON WHAT WE HAVE TO DO NOW. radical islam has to be totally eradicated and pushed into obscurity just like ? and maoism.
Your idea of escalating the war is EXACTLY what ISIS wants. It's one of the reasons I posted the Flames of War movie earlier, ISIS WANTS American boots on the ground. It's great propaganda for them and a huge recruiting tool but you still don't see that. By the way, according to news reports, America has been bombing Syria for the past hour tonight. Allegedly, 25 air strikes have been hitting ISIS Syrian positions. Your dreams of a wider war in that region will come true sooner then you think.
dog i don't care what isis wants, these people are religiously motivated, understand that, they think that allah is going to make them win no matter what happens. Therefore to obliterate this belief we have to fight them and totally destroy them.
let them KEEP recruiting as much as they want in the end it will only mean more dead isis members. our number one mistake has been in delaying the inevitable. in the middle east this barbaric version of islam that is really pure islam needs to be removed from the world. period.
ISIS is a religious group true but many of their allies are former members of Saddam's army and other less religious groups. Saddam was very secular, so for his former soldiers to join ISIS means this is more then just a religious thing. This is a mostly political problem, as even Americans have said. Of course, religious groups like ISIS are gaining members because they are beating their Shiite "oppressors", but as I said before, this is basically a Sunni-Shiite CIVIL WAR gone mad. If you want ISIS to KEEP recruiting easily, you are not thinking well at all. Do you realize how long a war this would be then? I forgot, you want America to open an empire in Iraq and lucky for you the MIC wants that too. There's too many oil companies and American contractor buildings to protect, question is how much is this gonna cost us? I hope Americans enjoy another trillion dollar war.
just because saddam was secular that does not mean his soliders were also, and i don't want isis to keep gaining members i just don't care if they do or not because it's largely unimportant if they do or not. They lack the firepower technologically and logistically to really go to war with a real nation that has real fighters. And a war against isiS right now would not last very long at all, within a month they would be falling back to using sneak attacks and hidden bombs. i want america to govern certain nations in the middle east the same way we did japan after ww2 leaving iraq so soon was a mistake.
with islam there is no political problems religious problems and political problems are the same thing if america follows your isolationist policy instead of fighting a trillion dollar war now we will fight a ten trillion dollar war 15 years from now.
Okay, you will see for yourself how horrible this all ends up. ISIS if anything will be more dangerous when they start fighting guerilla warfare, remember Vietnam and the 50K dead Americans. Iraqis killed close to 5K Americans and maimed over 20K more, so it doesn't take a high technology group to inflict damage during guerilla warfare. Remember, you are giving ISIS what they want ,so be careful what you wish for. Enjoy your new , long ass war. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »goldjordan wrote: »the only way to fix all these problems in the middle east is total invasion and total war followed by with a long term occupation. isis taking over syria would be a horror no one trust america over there so we can have no allies nor should we back anyone that is not under our direct control.
syria borders with israel and i don't think israel is going to stand for any of that ? if isis takes syria ? is going to get worse and the risk that it's only going to spread.
WORLD WAR THREE FOR PEACE
IT WON'T TAKE WW3 IF WE DON WHAT WE HAVE TO DO NOW. radical islam has to be totally eradicated and pushed into obscurity just like ? and maoism.
Your idea of escalating the war is EXACTLY what ISIS wants. It's one of the reasons I posted the Flames of War movie earlier, ISIS WANTS American boots on the ground. It's great propaganda for them and a huge recruiting tool but you still don't see that. By the way, according to news reports, America has been bombing Syria for the past hour tonight. Allegedly, 25 air strikes have been hitting ISIS Syrian positions. Your dreams of a wider war in that region will come true sooner then you think.
dog i don't care what isis wants, these people are religiously motivated, understand that, they think that allah is going to make them win no matter what happens. Therefore to obliterate this belief we have to fight them and totally destroy them.
let them KEEP recruiting as much as they want in the end it will only mean more dead isis members. our number one mistake has been in delaying the inevitable. in the middle east this barbaric version of islam that is really pure islam needs to be removed from the world. period.
ISIS is a religious group true but many of their allies are former members of Saddam's army and other less religious groups. Saddam was very secular, so for his former soldiers to join ISIS means this is more then just a religious thing. This is a mostly political problem, as even Americans have said. Of course, religious groups like ISIS are gaining members because they are beating their Shiite "oppressors", but as I said before, this is basically a Sunni-Shiite CIVIL WAR gone mad. If you want ISIS to KEEP recruiting easily, you are not thinking well at all. Do you realize how long a war this would be then? I forgot, you want America to open an empire in Iraq and lucky for you the MIC wants that too. There's too many oil companies and American contractor buildings to protect, question is how much is this gonna cost us? I hope Americans enjoy another trillion dollar war.
just because saddam was secular that does not mean his soliders were also, and i don't want isis to keep gaining members i just don't care if they do or not because it's largely unimportant if they do or not. They lack the firepower technologically and logistically to really go to war with a real nation that has real fighters. And a war against isiS right now would not last very long at all, within a month they would be falling back to using sneak attacks and hidden bombs. i want america to govern certain nations in the middle east the same way we did japan after ww2 leaving iraq so soon was a mistake.
with islam there is no political problems religious problems and political problems are the same thing if america follows your isolationist policy instead of fighting a trillion dollar war now we will fight a ten trillion dollar war 15 years from now.
Okay, you will see for yourself how horrible this all ends up. ISIS if anything will be more dangerous when they start fighting guerilla warfare, remember Vietnam and the 50K dead Americans. Iraqis killed close to 5K Americans and maimed over 20K more, so it doesn't take a high technology group to inflict damage during guerilla warfare. Remember, you are giving ISIS what they want ,so be careful what you wish for. Enjoy your new , long ass war.
This isn't a War. They are bombing from the air. Nobody said anything about committing troops. Even so, I'm sure Obama will deal with this situation effectively like he has dealt with other threats in the past without troops. They have the coalition you dreamed of. Why you still salty? There will always be and ISIS or Al Qaeda as long as radical Muslims want to spread their doctrine through terror. You wanna fall back and let them cook? -
FuriousOne wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »goldjordan wrote: »the only way to fix all these problems in the middle east is total invasion and total war followed by with a long term occupation. isis taking over syria would be a horror no one trust america over there so we can have no allies nor should we back anyone that is not under our direct control.
syria borders with israel and i don't think israel is going to stand for any of that ? if isis takes syria ? is going to get worse and the risk that it's only going to spread.
WORLD WAR THREE FOR PEACE
IT WON'T TAKE WW3 IF WE DON WHAT WE HAVE TO DO NOW. radical islam has to be totally eradicated and pushed into obscurity just like ? and maoism.
Your idea of escalating the war is EXACTLY what ISIS wants. It's one of the reasons I posted the Flames of War movie earlier, ISIS WANTS American boots on the ground. It's great propaganda for them and a huge recruiting tool but you still don't see that. By the way, according to news reports, America has been bombing Syria for the past hour tonight. Allegedly, 25 air strikes have been hitting ISIS Syrian positions. Your dreams of a wider war in that region will come true sooner then you think.
dog i don't care what isis wants, these people are religiously motivated, understand that, they think that allah is going to make them win no matter what happens. Therefore to obliterate this belief we have to fight them and totally destroy them.
let them KEEP recruiting as much as they want in the end it will only mean more dead isis members. our number one mistake has been in delaying the inevitable. in the middle east this barbaric version of islam that is really pure islam needs to be removed from the world. period.
ISIS is a religious group true but many of their allies are former members of Saddam's army and other less religious groups. Saddam was very secular, so for his former soldiers to join ISIS means this is more then just a religious thing. This is a mostly political problem, as even Americans have said. Of course, religious groups like ISIS are gaining members because they are beating their Shiite "oppressors", but as I said before, this is basically a Sunni-Shiite CIVIL WAR gone mad. If you want ISIS to KEEP recruiting easily, you are not thinking well at all. Do you realize how long a war this would be then? I forgot, you want America to open an empire in Iraq and lucky for you the MIC wants that too. There's too many oil companies and American contractor buildings to protect, question is how much is this gonna cost us? I hope Americans enjoy another trillion dollar war.
just because saddam was secular that does not mean his soliders were also, and i don't want isis to keep gaining members i just don't care if they do or not because it's largely unimportant if they do or not. They lack the firepower technologically and logistically to really go to war with a real nation that has real fighters. And a war against isiS right now would not last very long at all, within a month they would be falling back to using sneak attacks and hidden bombs. i want america to govern certain nations in the middle east the same way we did japan after ww2 leaving iraq so soon was a mistake.
with islam there is no political problems religious problems and political problems are the same thing if america follows your isolationist policy instead of fighting a trillion dollar war now we will fight a ten trillion dollar war 15 years from now.
Okay, you will see for yourself how horrible this all ends up. ISIS if anything will be more dangerous when they start fighting guerilla warfare, remember Vietnam and the 50K dead Americans. Iraqis killed close to 5K Americans and maimed over 20K more, so it doesn't take a high technology group to inflict damage during guerilla warfare. Remember, you are giving ISIS what they want ,so be careful what you wish for. Enjoy your new , long ass war.
This isn't a War. They are bombing from the air. Nobody said anything about committing troops. Even so, I'm sure Obama will deal with this situation effectively like he has dealt with other threats in the past without troops. They have the coalition you dreamed of. Why you still salty? There will always be and ISIS or Al Qaeda as long as radical Muslims want to spread their doctrine through terror. You wanna fall back and let them cook?
This ISN'T a war? The White House itself said we're at war against ISIS, so did other people in the administration. Iran said the air strikes are illegal and sadly it's true, it's why Europeans aren't participating in Syria, 5 Arab nations are and this should stay a regional issue in my opinion. It's a civil war gone out of control true, but butting in a civil war will make this a very messy situation, you'll see for yourself soon enough, just like we saw in 2003-2011. By the way, you know damn well American boots are gonna be on the ground soon. We add more and more troops there every month, and if ISIS or Khorosan or Al-Qaeda strikes back, everyone will expect American boots in Syria and Iraq. On top of Afghanistan lol but I hope this works, but I know it won't. Americans involved in the Middle East = creating more enemies, I wonder who the next terror group formed will be? Enjoy creating an ever growing list of enemies, and remember Yemen has a growing Islamist revolution on the come up too
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=mIuZ-u9hJaM
-
kingblaze84 wrote: »FuriousOne wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »goldjordan wrote: »the only way to fix all these problems in the middle east is total invasion and total war followed by with a long term occupation. isis taking over syria would be a horror no one trust america over there so we can have no allies nor should we back anyone that is not under our direct control.
syria borders with israel and i don't think israel is going to stand for any of that ? if isis takes syria ? is going to get worse and the risk that it's only going to spread.
WORLD WAR THREE FOR PEACE
IT WON'T TAKE WW3 IF WE DON WHAT WE HAVE TO DO NOW. radical islam has to be totally eradicated and pushed into obscurity just like ? and maoism.
Your idea of escalating the war is EXACTLY what ISIS wants. It's one of the reasons I posted the Flames of War movie earlier, ISIS WANTS American boots on the ground. It's great propaganda for them and a huge recruiting tool but you still don't see that. By the way, according to news reports, America has been bombing Syria for the past hour tonight. Allegedly, 25 air strikes have been hitting ISIS Syrian positions. Your dreams of a wider war in that region will come true sooner then you think.
dog i don't care what isis wants, these people are religiously motivated, understand that, they think that allah is going to make them win no matter what happens. Therefore to obliterate this belief we have to fight them and totally destroy them.
let them KEEP recruiting as much as they want in the end it will only mean more dead isis members. our number one mistake has been in delaying the inevitable. in the middle east this barbaric version of islam that is really pure islam needs to be removed from the world. period.
ISIS is a religious group true but many of their allies are former members of Saddam's army and other less religious groups. Saddam was very secular, so for his former soldiers to join ISIS means this is more then just a religious thing. This is a mostly political problem, as even Americans have said. Of course, religious groups like ISIS are gaining members because they are beating their Shiite "oppressors", but as I said before, this is basically a Sunni-Shiite CIVIL WAR gone mad. If you want ISIS to KEEP recruiting easily, you are not thinking well at all. Do you realize how long a war this would be then? I forgot, you want America to open an empire in Iraq and lucky for you the MIC wants that too. There's too many oil companies and American contractor buildings to protect, question is how much is this gonna cost us? I hope Americans enjoy another trillion dollar war.
just because saddam was secular that does not mean his soliders were also, and i don't want isis to keep gaining members i just don't care if they do or not because it's largely unimportant if they do or not. They lack the firepower technologically and logistically to really go to war with a real nation that has real fighters. And a war against isiS right now would not last very long at all, within a month they would be falling back to using sneak attacks and hidden bombs. i want america to govern certain nations in the middle east the same way we did japan after ww2 leaving iraq so soon was a mistake.
with islam there is no political problems religious problems and political problems are the same thing if america follows your isolationist policy instead of fighting a trillion dollar war now we will fight a ten trillion dollar war 15 years from now.
Okay, you will see for yourself how horrible this all ends up. ISIS if anything will be more dangerous when they start fighting guerilla warfare, remember Vietnam and the 50K dead Americans. Iraqis killed close to 5K Americans and maimed over 20K more, so it doesn't take a high technology group to inflict damage during guerilla warfare. Remember, you are giving ISIS what they want ,so be careful what you wish for. Enjoy your new , long ass war.
This isn't a War. They are bombing from the air. Nobody said anything about committing troops. Even so, I'm sure Obama will deal with this situation effectively like he has dealt with other threats in the past without troops. They have the coalition you dreamed of. Why you still salty? There will always be and ISIS or Al Qaeda as long as radical Muslims want to spread their doctrine through terror. You wanna fall back and let them cook?
This ISN'T a war? The White House itself said we're at war against ISIS, so did other people in the administration. Iran said the air strikes are illegal and sadly it's true, it's why Europeans aren't participating in Syria, 5 Arab nations are and this should stay a regional issue in my opinion. It's a civil war gone out of control true, but butting in a civil war will make this a very messy situation, you'll see for yourself soon enough, just like we saw in 2003-2011. By the way, you know damn well American boots are gonna be on the ground soon. We add more and more troops there every month, and if ISIS or Khorosan or Al-Qaeda strikes back, everyone will expect American boots in Syria and Iraq. On top of Afghanistan lol but I hope this works, but I know it won't. Americans involved in the Middle East = creating more enemies, I wonder who the next terror group formed will be? Enjoy creating an ever growing list of enemies, and remember Yemen has a growing Islamist revolution on the come up too
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=mIuZ-u9hJaM
Yes ISIS. We are at war with ISIS. Not Syria nor Iraq or Iran, or even Afghanistan technically. We those continuous troops on the ground going? I thought we were gradually pulling out of Afghanistan. You talking about the few marines that went into iraq got ? done and boogied? We actually have allies in all countries except for Iran. And Iran needs to fall the ? back. They couldn't do ? in against ISIS in Iraq and we had to bail them ? out. Now it's, oh it's illegal. ? and enjoy the rest of these sanctions. Like i said, Obama be making classic maneuvers but you keep expecting him to do Bush ? . What are you bringing up those old engagements for? ? done happened, and now we dealing with ? correctly along with allies. Iraq is sanctioning, and the Rebels are down for the team. ISIS is not involved in a Civil War. ISIS is involved in massacre and has no good intentions towards anyone other then themselves. No Syrian government forces were targeted. So first it was Arabs should get down and now it's Europeans? You must want North Korea to give sanction too. France is ? ? up in Iraq and even the British has been in there. You didn't even know about Khorosan until they got they ? fricasseed. Shows you how much you know compared to how much people who matter knows.. We add more troops to Afghanistan. Stop trying to conflate the two issues. The Taliban don't even ? with ISIS. Al Qaeda been everywhere and we been ? em up. What's new? All who rise shall fall.. -
amongst all the craziness that hasn't even begun to be solved in our backyard, and ? trippin about ISIS.
