Nas, Wu Tang & The Beastie Boys All Sampled It, So Why Has This LP Been Forgotten?
Options
5 Grand
Members Posts: 12,869 ✭✭✭✭✭
Hustler's Convention - Lightnin Rod
The cultural bridge between African-American art forms in the ’60s and ’70s and what would eventually become Hip-Hop as we know it has been the subject of countless documentaries, books, academic papers, and of course, songs. However, despite all of the devotion to preserving the history behind the culture, there are those who are lost, forgotten, or never even recognized as having played integral roles in the birth of Hip-Hop. While names like DJ Kool Herc, Joe Conzo, and Sylvia Robinson are familiar to most Heads, Jalal Nuriddin, Lightnin’ Rod, and Hustlers Convention have been largely obfuscated by years of passing time. However, that may all soon change, thanks to the efforts some particularly dedicated art lovers.
On Malcolm X’s birthday in 1968, Marcus Garvey Park in East Harlem served as the site for the birth of the Last Poets, an umbrella term for a host of artists and musicians who rose to prominence during and after the Civil Rights Era, turning to various forms of art as sources for the social and political mobilization of African-Americans. While comprised in its original form of Gylan Kain, Felipe Luciano, and David Nelson, the Last Poets would take on various forms and constitutions, one of which was led by Nuriddin, who also released albums under the pseudonym of Lightnin’ Rod. In 1973, he released Hustlers Convention, a seminal piece of Black Art that has been heralded by Grandmaster Caz, Fab 5 Freddy, and Grandmaster Melle Mel as insurmountably influential in the cultivation of the next generation’s Black Art: Hip-Hop.
The most direct influence, artistically, was Nuriddin’s use of toasting throughout the album, in the particular style of “jail toasting.” In his own words, these pseudo spoken-word stories “were rhyming jokes but they didn’t have much content…I felt something new needed to be done to lay down the whys and wherefores of street life, its attractions and distractions.” Those whys and wherefores took the form of Sport and Spoon, two hustling brothers whose dalliances with drugs, money, and sex depicted the real-life experiences of countless Black youth in New York City’s ghettos.
For several years after its release, the album was influencing the developing consciousness of men and women who would become the cultural purveyors of their own surroundings. Fab 5 Freddy, in an interview with the Guardian, shares “I memorised it and would recite it to friends on my block, then someone told me it was based on a record. I stumbled upon that and passed it on. Hip street guys like Melle Mel would know about it. I could hear the influence in their raps.” Hip street guys like that are responsible for imbuing much of Hip-Hop’s earliest works with bits of Hustlers Convention. “Sport” can be heard on Wu-Tang Clan’s “Method Man” and the Beastie Boys’ “Egg Man;” on Main Source’s “Snake Eyes,” and “Brother Hominy Grit” on the D.O.C.’s “It’s Funky Enough,” just to name an iota.
More than 40 years after its initial release, the album will be performed in its entirety in London next month, but Heads all over the world will have an opportunity to learn more about the overlooked piece of history in a forthcoming film directed by Mike Todd and produced by Chuck D, scheduled for a late 2015 release. Until then, stream the album in its entirety right here, through Spotify.
http://ambrosiaforheads.com/2015/06/nas-wu-tang-beastie-boys-all-sampled-it-so-why-has-this-lp-been-forgotten-album-stream/
The cultural bridge between African-American art forms in the ’60s and ’70s and what would eventually become Hip-Hop as we know it has been the subject of countless documentaries, books, academic papers, and of course, songs. However, despite all of the devotion to preserving the history behind the culture, there are those who are lost, forgotten, or never even recognized as having played integral roles in the birth of Hip-Hop. While names like DJ Kool Herc, Joe Conzo, and Sylvia Robinson are familiar to most Heads, Jalal Nuriddin, Lightnin’ Rod, and Hustlers Convention have been largely obfuscated by years of passing time. However, that may all soon change, thanks to the efforts some particularly dedicated art lovers.
On Malcolm X’s birthday in 1968, Marcus Garvey Park in East Harlem served as the site for the birth of the Last Poets, an umbrella term for a host of artists and musicians who rose to prominence during and after the Civil Rights Era, turning to various forms of art as sources for the social and political mobilization of African-Americans. While comprised in its original form of Gylan Kain, Felipe Luciano, and David Nelson, the Last Poets would take on various forms and constitutions, one of which was led by Nuriddin, who also released albums under the pseudonym of Lightnin’ Rod. In 1973, he released Hustlers Convention, a seminal piece of Black Art that has been heralded by Grandmaster Caz, Fab 5 Freddy, and Grandmaster Melle Mel as insurmountably influential in the cultivation of the next generation’s Black Art: Hip-Hop.
The most direct influence, artistically, was Nuriddin’s use of toasting throughout the album, in the particular style of “jail toasting.” In his own words, these pseudo spoken-word stories “were rhyming jokes but they didn’t have much content…I felt something new needed to be done to lay down the whys and wherefores of street life, its attractions and distractions.” Those whys and wherefores took the form of Sport and Spoon, two hustling brothers whose dalliances with drugs, money, and sex depicted the real-life experiences of countless Black youth in New York City’s ghettos.
For several years after its release, the album was influencing the developing consciousness of men and women who would become the cultural purveyors of their own surroundings. Fab 5 Freddy, in an interview with the Guardian, shares “I memorised it and would recite it to friends on my block, then someone told me it was based on a record. I stumbled upon that and passed it on. Hip street guys like Melle Mel would know about it. I could hear the influence in their raps.” Hip street guys like that are responsible for imbuing much of Hip-Hop’s earliest works with bits of Hustlers Convention. “Sport” can be heard on Wu-Tang Clan’s “Method Man” and the Beastie Boys’ “Egg Man;” on Main Source’s “Snake Eyes,” and “Brother Hominy Grit” on the D.O.C.’s “It’s Funky Enough,” just to name an iota.
More than 40 years after its initial release, the album will be performed in its entirety in London next month, but Heads all over the world will have an opportunity to learn more about the overlooked piece of history in a forthcoming film directed by Mike Todd and produced by Chuck D, scheduled for a late 2015 release. Until then, stream the album in its entirety right here, through Spotify.
http://ambrosiaforheads.com/2015/06/nas-wu-tang-beastie-boys-all-sampled-it-so-why-has-this-lp-been-forgotten-album-stream/
Comments
-
We forgot because everybody that was alive when it came out has passed over due to old age, no hate is it any good?
-
I never forgot it. That record is dope. And samplewise it's on the same level as that E.S.G. record and to a lesser extent Dr. Buzzard's Original Savannah Band.
-
willywanker wrote: »We forgot because everybody that was alive when it came out has passed over due to old age, no hate is it any good?
So I guess you don't listen to Duke Ellington, Charlie Parker, Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davis, James Brown, Marvin Gaye, Aretha Franklin, Jimi Hendrix, The Beatles, The Rolling Stones, Pink Floyd, Led Zepplin, Bob Marley or Kool & The Gang.
When you try to make jokes dissing classic music you come off like a complete idiot and uncultured. You'd do yourself a big favor by listening to music that came out in decades besides the 2010s.
Here's some albums you should listen to that came out before your time;
1. April In Paris - Charlie Parker (1950)
2. Bird and Diz - Charlie Parker feat Dizzy Gillespie (1950)
3. Birth of the Cool - Miles Davis (1949/50)
4. Sketches of Spain - Miles Davis (1960)
5. The Payback - James Brown* (1973)
6. Never Mind The Bullocks; Here's The Sex Pistols (1977)
7. Hustler's Convention - Lightning Rod (1973)
8. Natty Dread - Bob Marley (1974)
9. What's Going On - Marvin Gaye (1971)
10. Your Arms Are Too Short To Box With ? - Original Motion Picture Soundtrack (1977)
11. Like A Ripple On A Pond - Nikki Giovanni (1973)
12. Genius + Soul = Jazz - Ray Charles (1961)
13. Ultimate Breaks and Beats Vol 1-25 (excluding Vol. 508) (1966-1984)
* You should also try to cop Damn Right I Am Somebody by Fred Wesley & The J.B.s. That album is by James Brown's band and was recorded in the same session.
^^^ That's the kind of vibe I've been on recently
Anyway,
I listened to Hustler's Convention about a week ago.
Its one of the most amazing albums I've ever heard. Definitely a top 100 album of all time in any genre, maybe even top 20. -
Bump
Its unbelievable that people could spend so much time on a Hip Hop message board and have tens of thousands of posts (Yes You Mods!) and not have anything to say about how Hip Hop originated or give an opinion about (arguably) the first rap album.
At the very least ya'll could listen to Hustler's Convention and type a lil paragraph about what you liked or didn't like about it.
While we're at it, ya'll should listen to Like A Ripple On A Pond by Nikki Giovanni, it came out around the same time as Hustler's Convention; Both masterpieces. -
The title of the thread is "why has this album been forgotten"
Can somebody please add on to why the new generation of Hip Hoppers don't care about this monumental album?
I've made threads about this album and I'm lucky to get 2 or 3 responses.
I'm really interested to hear from somebody who has listened to this album and what they think of it.
At least could somebody explain why they don't listen to older rap?
At one point in time you could say that older rappers were more simple and that newer rappers had more complex flows, but thats not true anymore. I'd put an old school rapper up against a Southern rapper any day of the week. -
You already know I'm bout that life
-
Dope album, it's a spoken word piece. I think Kool and the Gang did the music if I'm not mistaken
-
king hassan wrote: »Dope album, it's a spoken word piece. I think Kool and the Gang did the music if I'm not mistaken
Yeah Kool & the Gang did the background music on some of the songs but not all of them. -
They do have this out on CD as well
-
? is cool, and yeah influential it was.
But I prefer stuff like this better as some dope ass (rap song) intro.
Good drop tho
Demon Fuzz - Afreaka! (@5grand) -
So here's a question for the people that won't/don't listen to Hustler's Convention;
What do you listen to besides modern rap music?
Obviously ya'll don't listen to old school rap because whenever I make a thread about something old school all I hear is *crickets*. So what do ya'll listen to besides Young Thug, Drake and Lil Wayne? -
willywanker wrote: »We forgot because everybody that was alive when it came out has passed over due to old age, no hate is it any good?
So I guess you don't listen to Duke Ellington, Charlie Parker, Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davis, James Brown, Marvin Gaye, Aretha Franklin, Jimi Hendrix, The Beatles, The Rolling Stones, Pink Floyd, Led Zepplin, Bob Marley or Kool & The Gang.
When you try to make jokes dissing classic music you come off like a complete idiot and uncultured. You'd do yourself a big favor by listening to music that came out in decades besides the 2010s.
Here's some albums you should listen to that came out before your time;
1. April In Paris - Charlie Parker (1950)
2. Bird and Diz - Charlie Parker feat Dizzy Gillespie (1950)
3. Birth of the Cool - Miles Davis (1949/50)
4. Sketches of Spain - Miles Davis (1960)
5. The Payback - James Brown* (1973)
6. Never Mind The Bullocks; Here's The Sex Pistols (1977)
7. Hustler's Convention - Lightning Rod (1973)
8. Natty Dread - Bob Marley (1974)
9. What's Going On - Marvin Gaye (1971)
10. Your Arms Are Too Short To Box With ? - Original Motion Picture Soundtrack (1977)
11. Like A Ripple On A Pond - Nikki Giovanni (1973)
12. Genius + Soul = Jazz - Ray Charles (1961)
13. Ultimate Breaks and Beats Vol 1-25 (excluding Vol. 508) (1966-1984)
* You should also try to cop Damn Right I Am Somebody by Fred Wesley & The J.B.s. That album is by James Brown's band and was recorded in the same session.
^^^ That's the kind of vibe I've been on recently
Anyway,
I listened to Hustler's Convention about a week ago.
Its one of the most amazing albums I've ever heard. Definitely a top 100 album of all time in any genre, maybe even top 20.
Thanks for your recommendations, surprised to see the sex pistols on your list, I have listened to some of them ppl like james brown, bob marley and marvin gaye, I have heard good things about miles davis, I have been listening to little richard lately that guys a beast, excuse my comment I was fishing for likes like a damn fool. -
I learned that a lot of the samples used had some dope LPs behind them. And most of them were slept on when they came out at the time. Dudes like Melvin Bliss, Rufus Thomas and Joe Tex were way ahead of their time.
-
I got some Rufus Thomas and Joe Tex recoreds and donuts, I got that Melvin Bliss record on re-issueI learned that a lot of the samples used had some dope LPs behind them. And most of them were slept on when they came out at the time. Dudes like Melvin Bliss, Rufus Thomas and Joe Tex were way ahead of their time.
-
Really, if you want to talk about funk/soul/jazz samples. The type of stuff that people sample, Look no further;
^^^ This is the ULTIMATE Breaks and Beats. It has the proper name. Ultimate. Every song, I mean every single song on there has a drum break that somebody sampled.
I made a post about this series a few weeks ago. Its 25 volumes, over 150 songs. The earliest song is from 1966 and the latest is from 1984.
Its definitely a desert island compilation, meaning if I was stranded on a desert island I wouldn't mind having the Ultimate Breaks and Beats series on my iPod.
And by the way, there's a song from Hustler's Convention on Vol. 16 called Sport. That's the beat that Nas sampled on Street's Disciple -
willywanker wrote: »willywanker wrote: »We forgot because everybody that was alive when it came out has passed over due to old age, no hate is it any good?
So I guess you don't listen to Duke Ellington, Charlie Parker, Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davis, James Brown, Marvin Gaye, Aretha Franklin, Jimi Hendrix, The Beatles, The Rolling Stones, Pink Floyd, Led Zepplin, Bob Marley or Kool & The Gang.
When you try to make jokes dissing classic music you come off like a complete idiot and uncultured. You'd do yourself a big favor by listening to music that came out in decades besides the 2010s.
Here's some albums you should listen to that came out before your time;
1. April In Paris - Charlie Parker (1950)
2. Bird and Diz - Charlie Parker feat Dizzy Gillespie (1950)
3. Birth of the Cool - Miles Davis (1949/50)
4. Sketches of Spain - Miles Davis (1960)
5. The Payback - James Brown* (1973)
6. Never Mind The Bullocks; Here's The Sex Pistols (1977)
7. Hustler's Convention - Lightning Rod (1973)
8. Natty Dread - Bob Marley (1974)
9. What's Going On - Marvin Gaye (1971)
10. Your Arms Are Too Short To Box With ? - Original Motion Picture Soundtrack (1977)
11. Like A Ripple On A Pond - Nikki Giovanni (1973)
12. Genius + Soul = Jazz - Ray Charles (1961)
13. Ultimate Breaks and Beats Vol 1-25 (excluding Vol. 508) (1966-1984)
* You should also try to cop Damn Right I Am Somebody by Fred Wesley & The J.B.s. That album is by James Brown's band and was recorded in the same session.
^^^ That's the kind of vibe I've been on recently
Anyway,
I listened to Hustler's Convention about a week ago.
Its one of the most amazing albums I've ever heard. Definitely a top 100 album of all time in any genre, maybe even top 20.
Thanks for your recommendations, surprised to see the sex pistols on your list, I have listened to some of them ppl like james brown, bob marley and marvin gaye, I have heard good things about miles davis, I have been listening to little richard lately that guys a beast, excuse my comment I was fishing for likes like a damn fool.
If you're interested in Miles Davis, the two albums I listed are more on the classical side. A lot of jazz fans don't have the patience to listen to classical. Here's some Miles Davis albums with a lil more flavor;
1. Kind of Blue
2. In A Silent Way
3. ? Brew
4. Miles In The Sky
5. Jack Johnson
6. Miles Smiles
7. On The Corner
8. The Man With The Horn
9. Tutu
10. Doo Bop (this is a Hip Hop album he made in 1992. I believe its his last album)
Honorable Mentions;
Filles De Kilimanjaro
My Funny Valentine
Nefertiti
ESP
-
So here's a question for the people that won't/don't listen to Hustler's Convention;
What do you listen to besides modern rap music?
Obviously ya'll don't listen to old school rap because whenever I make a thread about something old school all I hear is *crickets*. So what do ya'll listen to besides Young Thug, Drake and Lil Wayne?
Not sure how old you are but, Hip Hop will always be for the youth. Hip hop isn't like other genres of music, you don't see 80's rappers going on tour selling out high school auditoriums, let alone stadiums like you see 70's, 80's, 90's rock bands.
Just face it, most Hip Hop "fans" got the attention span of finding Nemo, couldn't tell you who was hot 10 years ago, and asking them to check out music from before they were born fagettaboutit, it aint happening.
I'm generalizing here but the fact that you're getting no response, on a Hip Hop forum, about old school classics that paved the way for modern Hip Hop, should speak for it self. -
Why should I care
-
So here's a question for the people that won't/don't listen to Hustler's Convention;
What do you listen to besides modern rap music?
Obviously ya'll don't listen to old school rap because whenever I make a thread about something old school all I hear is *crickets*. So what do ya'll listen to besides Young Thug, Drake and Lil Wayne?
Not sure how old you are but, Hip Hop will always be for the youth. Hip hop isn't like other genres of music, you don't see 80's rappers going on tour selling out high school auditoriums, let alone stadiums like you see 70's, 80's, 90's rock bands.
Just face it, most Hip Hop "fans" got the attention span of finding Nemo, couldn't tell you who was hot 10 years ago, and asking them to check out music from before they were born fagettaboutit, it aint happening.
I'm generalizing here but the fact that you're getting no response, on a Hip Hop forum, about old school classics that paved the way for modern Hip Hop, should speak for it self.
Your post doesn't make any sense.
I grew up on Hip Hop. Literally. Me and Hip Hop are the same age; Kool Herc threw his first party in August of 1973 and I was born in September 73, a month later.
I remember when the Sugarhill Gang came out. I remember Kurtis Blow. I remember seeing Beat Street in the movie theatre. I remember going to see Run DMC @ the Providence Civic Center in 1988. DJ Jazzy Jeff and the Fresh Prince were the opening act.
I'm not sure how old YOU are but I'm positive you're not old enough to articulate your claim that "Hip Hop will always be for the youth". It would be impossible to articulate that claim because I'm 41 and I made 5 beats today. I'd post em but I know ? steal other peoples beats they find online and sell them overseas. -
So here's a question for the people that won't/don't listen to Hustler's Convention;
What do you listen to besides modern rap music?
Obviously ya'll don't listen to old school rap because whenever I make a thread about something old school all I hear is *crickets*. So what do ya'll listen to besides Young Thug, Drake and Lil Wayne?
Not sure how old you are but, Hip Hop will always be for the youth. Hip hop isn't like other genres of music, you don't see 80's rappers going on tour selling out high school auditoriums, let alone stadiums like you see 70's, 80's, 90's rock bands.
Just face it, most Hip Hop "fans" got the attention span of finding Nemo, couldn't tell you who was hot 10 years ago, and asking them to check out music from before they were born fagettaboutit, it aint happening.
I'm generalizing here but the fact that you're getting no response, on a Hip Hop forum, about old school classics that paved the way for modern Hip Hop, should speak for it self.
Your post doesn't make any sense.
I grew up on Hip Hop. Literally. Me and Hip Hop are the same age; Kool Herc threw his first party in August of 1973 and I was born in September 73, a month later.
I remember when the Sugarhill Gang came out. I remember Kurtis Blow. I remember seeing Beat Street in the movie theatre. I remember going to see Run DMC @ the Providence Civic Center in 1988. DJ Jazzy Jeff and the Fresh Prince were the opening act.
I'm not sure how old YOU are but I'm positive you're not old enough to articulate your claim that "Hip Hop will always be for the youth". It would be impossible to articulate that claim because I'm 41 and I made 5 beats today. I'd post em but I know ? steal other peoples beats they find online and sell them overseas.
Bro I'm 30, you sounding like Common on the "i used to love h.e.r" track right now.
Kool Herc, Sugarhill Gang, Beat Street, DJ Jazzy Jeff...... you listen to/checking for any of their new ? ?
These new producers don't sample old school classics anymore, so why would someone go digging in the creates for a track that they have no point of reference to.
As far as Hip Hop being for the youth, name a rapper that got into the game and had moderate buzz post 35+. -
So here's a question for the people that won't/don't listen to Hustler's Convention;
What do you listen to besides modern rap music?
Obviously ya'll don't listen to old school rap because whenever I make a thread about something old school all I hear is *crickets*. So what do ya'll listen to besides Young Thug, Drake and Lil Wayne?
Not sure how old you are but, Hip Hop will always be for the youth. Hip hop isn't like other genres of music, you don't see 80's rappers going on tour selling out high school auditoriums, let alone stadiums like you see 70's, 80's, 90's rock bands.
Just face it, most Hip Hop "fans" got the attention span of finding Nemo, couldn't tell you who was hot 10 years ago, and asking them to check out music from before they were born fagettaboutit, it aint happening.
I'm generalizing here but the fact that you're getting no response, on a Hip Hop forum, about old school classics that paved the way for modern Hip Hop, should speak for it self.
Your post doesn't make any sense.
I grew up on Hip Hop. Literally. Me and Hip Hop are the same age; Kool Herc threw his first party in August of 1973 and I was born in September 73, a month later.
I remember when the Sugarhill Gang came out. I remember Kurtis Blow. I remember seeing Beat Street in the movie theatre. I remember going to see Run DMC @ the Providence Civic Center in 1988. DJ Jazzy Jeff and the Fresh Prince were the opening act.
I'm not sure how old YOU are but I'm positive you're not old enough to articulate your claim that "Hip Hop will always be for the youth". It would be impossible to articulate that claim because I'm 41 and I made 5 beats today. I'd post em but I know ? steal other peoples beats they find online and sell them overseas.
Bro I'm 30, you sounding like Common on the "i used to love h.e.r" track right now.
Kool Herc, Sugarhill Gang, Beat Street, DJ Jazzy Jeff...... you listen to/checking for any of their new ? ?
These new producers don't sample old school classics anymore, so why would someone go digging in the creates for a track that they have no point of reference to.
As far as Hip Hop being for the youth, name a rapper that got into the game and had moderate buzz post 35+.
@ the bolded. Thats because younger people are easier to manipulate and are very naive. Case in point, look at that video of Bobby Shmurda dancing on the table to get a record deal. Somebody over 35 would never stoop that low for a record deal.
The older generation OWNS Hip Hop; Dr Dre, Ice Cube, P Diddy, Jay Z, Baby. Those guys can collectively snap their fingers and make something happen, or stop it from happening.
But yeah, its the younger cats that have dreams of being a rapper. Back in the 80s (and even 70s if you want to go that far back). every teenager had dreams of being a rapper (myself included). But the sands of time move on and reality sets in. A lot of people in their 30s, 40s and 50s have jobs as promoters, managers or own nightclubs where the rappers perform. Many of the people from the 90s that you think fell off are working in the industry as ghostwriters or ghost producers.
And as far as Kool Herc, Sugarhill Gang and DJ Jazzy Jeff, hell yeah I'm checking for them. Whenever they come on TV or get mentioned anywhere I'm all ears. Every once in a while I'll treck up to the city to catch one of those old school reunions. I can remember seeing Cold Crush in Crotona Park a few years back, I went to a Zulu Nation Anniversarry where Jazzy Jay was the DJ not too long ago. And I can also say I saw Grandmaster flash spin at Harvard University at a Hip Hop Conference.
So yeah, I'm still 100% Hip Hop. I just don't wear skinny jeans and listen to ratchet music that's based on 808 and hi-hats doing double and triple time because that's not Hip Hop to me. Its not.
