The Pope admits that sometimes he loses faith.....is this common among Christians or others?
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If losing faith means losing trust...sure. It's an everyday struggle to devote yourself to the will of ? when you feel that your will should be done first.
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kingblaze84 wrote: »today I learned the pope is human
The Pope deserves credit for his honesty but still, if I was a Catholic or Christian, I wouldn't like the LEADER of my church saying PUBLICLY he doubts his own religion. I can't even imagine a Muslim iman saying something like that publicly. I couldn't imagine Creflo Dollar or TD Jake saying that either, but maybe they have more faith then the Pope does.
Nah I disagree fam. Someone who can reconcile their doubts and find reasons to continue believing in the face of conflicting evidence can be more compelling than someone who has never had to overcome such doubt. It shows a more reasoned approach to religious convictions. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »today I learned the pope is human
The Pope deserves credit for his honesty but still, if I was a Catholic or Christian, I wouldn't like the LEADER of my church saying PUBLICLY he doubts his own religion. I can't even imagine a Muslim iman saying something like that publicly. I couldn't imagine Creflo Dollar or TD Jake saying that either, but maybe they have more faith then the Pope does.
Nah I disagree fam. Someone who can reconcile their doubts and find reasons to continue believing in the face of conflicting evidence can be more compelling than someone who has never had to overcome such doubt. It shows a more reasoned approach to religious convictions.
I dont agree ,in ANY FIELD ,if your leader dont even believe , you should get another leader if not you are destined to fail -
Losing ones faith is not disbelief
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Ether44mag wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »today I learned the pope is human
The Pope deserves credit for his honesty but still, if I was a Catholic or Christian, I wouldn't like the LEADER of my church saying PUBLICLY he doubts his own religion. I can't even imagine a Muslim iman saying something like that publicly. I couldn't imagine Creflo Dollar or TD Jake saying that either, but maybe they have more faith then the Pope does.
Nah I disagree fam. Someone who can reconcile their doubts and find reasons to continue believing in the face of conflicting evidence can be more compelling than someone who has never had to overcome such doubt. It shows a more reasoned approach to religious convictions.
I dont agree ,in ANY FIELD ,if your leader dont even believe , you should get another leader if not you are destined to fail
If a person is presented with conflicting evidence and doesn't suspend belief or withdraw previous convictions that's not a faithful man, that's a ? . Only fools hold onto their beliefs when the evidence contradicts them.
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kingblaze84 wrote: »ALL CHRISTIANS WAIVER IN FAITH FROM TIME TO TIME, ITS APART OF BEING HUMAN.. BUT TO SAY, "sometimes he doesn't even have faith in his own religion" IS CRAZY.. WHEN THINGS GET BAD OR WE DONT SEE HOW THINGS CAN POSSIBLY TURN FOR THE BETTER; AT THAT TIME, WE LET OUR FLESH/THOUGHTS TAKE OVER OUR SPIRIT. BUT THATS THE WHOLE THING WITH FAITH; HOW "STRONG" IS YOUR FAITH IN ? .
I can understand all that, but the Pope did say that he doubts his own faith at times, especially when he deals with victims of natural disasters or those who have lost someone close to them.
In a world full of tragedies like this one, how do you personally keep your faith in Christianity? I have family who is Christian and when I ask them how they keep their faith, a lot of them say they just need something to believe in.
BECAUSE, THE BIBLE THAT HE READS AND FOLLOWS, FORE TOLD HIM AND US THAT THESE THINGS WILL HAPPEN AS A RESULT OF SIN...
NO DOUBT ITS MESSED UP AND YOU WONDER "WHY" -
? said u only need a mustard seed for a reason
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alissowack wrote: »If losing faith means losing trust...sure. It's an everyday struggle to devote yourself to the will of ? when you feel that your will should be done first.
I can respect the honesty. What makes you regain trust or faith in Jesus again then, considering the doubts you had? -
kingblaze84 wrote: »today I learned the pope is human
The Pope deserves credit for his honesty but still, if I was a Catholic or Christian, I wouldn't like the LEADER of my church saying PUBLICLY he doubts his own religion. I can't even imagine a Muslim iman saying something like that publicly. I couldn't imagine Creflo Dollar or TD Jake saying that either, but maybe they have more faith then the Pope does.
Nah I disagree fam. Someone who can reconcile their doubts and find reasons to continue believing in the face of conflicting evidence can be more compelling than someone who has never had to overcome such doubt. It shows a more reasoned approach to religious convictions.
I see your point of view, but I would have more faith in a leader if he or she has strong convictions in what they believe. For one to run a religious organization that claims decree from "? " sounds a little strange to me when that same leader says he is unsure his decree from ? is the real thing. If it came from a younger person, I would have more understanding, but coming from an 80 something year old, it seems a little odd for a leader.
The Pope as I said before does deserve credit for his open mindedness, he may believe in his Christian beliefs or maybe he's on the fence. Can't say for sure. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »ALL CHRISTIANS WAIVER IN FAITH FROM TIME TO TIME, ITS APART OF BEING HUMAN.. BUT TO SAY, "sometimes he doesn't even have faith in his own religion" IS CRAZY.. WHEN THINGS GET BAD OR WE DONT SEE HOW THINGS CAN POSSIBLY TURN FOR THE BETTER; AT THAT TIME, WE LET OUR FLESH/THOUGHTS TAKE OVER OUR SPIRIT. BUT THATS THE WHOLE THING WITH FAITH; HOW "STRONG" IS YOUR FAITH IN ? .
I can understand all that, but the Pope did say that he doubts his own faith at times, especially when he deals with victims of natural disasters or those who have lost someone close to them.
In a world full of tragedies like this one, how do you personally keep your faith in Christianity? I have family who is Christian and when I ask them how they keep their faith, a lot of them say they just need something to believe in.
BECAUSE, THE BIBLE THAT HE READS AND FOLLOWS, FORE TOLD HIM AND US THAT THESE THINGS WILL HAPPEN AS A RESULT OF SIN...
NO DOUBT ITS MESSED UP AND YOU WONDER "WHY"
And that's the thing, after all these years, not much action from Jesus. Doesn't it seem a little weird that Jesus doesn't want to fight sin a little bit in person? Let's be real, people are always going to "sin", it's more or less built into our DNA. As a former Christian, I still remain amazed how anyone can keep faith in such an inactive ? as the one you believe in, but I suppose people have their reasons. -
playmaker88 wrote: »Losing ones faith is not disbelief
Yeah, he may be on the fence or just re-considering his beliefs. He very well might still be Christian, but only he knows deep down....this whole situation reminds me of Mother Theresa and how her true beliefs came out, but anything is possible. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »If losing faith means losing trust...sure. It's an everyday struggle to devote yourself to the will of ? when you feel that your will should be done first.
I can respect the honesty. What makes you regain trust or faith in Jesus again then, considering the doubts you had?
Well...it's understanding that it is normal to feel that way. People get the impression that giving your life to ? is like some 30 day challenge where you do the usual prayers and stuff and you see the results at the end. There should never be a point in this life where you can say you understand the will of ? . That can provoke pride and "pride comes before the fall". -
alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »If losing faith means losing trust...sure. It's an everyday struggle to devote yourself to the will of ? when you feel that your will should be done first.
I can respect the honesty. What makes you regain trust or faith in Jesus again then, considering the doubts you had?
Well...it's understanding that it is normal to feel that way. People get the impression that giving your life to ? is like some 30 day challenge where you do the usual prayers and stuff and you see the results at the end. There should never be a point in this life where you can say you understand the will of ? . That can provoke pride and "pride comes before the fall".
Very interesting, so even up till now, your faith experiences pulls in the opposite direction. My patience is good but when it comes to the supernatural, I tend to expect more and I'm not as patient. I wouldn't call it pride though, people tend to expect a lot from others, and when those expectations fall short, we tend to stop trusting or believing.
Like if I had a friend who I felt was purposefully avoiding me, and never made much effort to contact me, I would assume after awhile that person maybe is not interested in speaking to me or seeing me anymore. When I realized Jesus had no interest in letting himself be seen or visible to those in need, my faith in Christianity became shattered. It's a little bigger then pride in my view, cuz someone like Mother Theresa seemed as humble as it gets, yet her faith became shattered too. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »If losing faith means losing trust...sure. It's an everyday struggle to devote yourself to the will of ? when you feel that your will should be done first.
I can respect the honesty. What makes you regain trust or faith in Jesus again then, considering the doubts you had?
Well...it's understanding that it is normal to feel that way. People get the impression that giving your life to ? is like some 30 day challenge where you do the usual prayers and stuff and you see the results at the end. There should never be a point in this life where you can say you understand the will of ? . That can provoke pride and "pride comes before the fall".
Very interesting, so even up till now, your faith experiences pulls in the opposite direction. My patience is good but when it comes to the supernatural, I tend to expect more and I'm not as patient. I wouldn't call it pride though, people tend to expect a lot from others, and when those expectations fall short, we tend to stop trusting or believing.
Like if I had a friend who I felt was purposefully avoiding me, and never made much effort to contact me, I would assume after awhile that person maybe is not interested in speaking to me or seeing me anymore. When I realized Jesus had no interest in letting himself be seen or visible to those in need, my faith in Christianity became shattered. It's a little bigger then pride in my view, cuz someone like Mother Theresa seemed as humble as it gets, yet her faith became shattered too.
I mean pride in understanding the will of ? . You may have encountered some of us who preach and do so believing they know more than you about the will of ? ...and it reflects in how they try to shame you into coming to faith. It's those people who don't understand what ? intends to do. They don't know how ? is going to use them or how He is going to use the non-believer. Everybody's circumstances in life is unique and it just could be that it won't be us to "save" them. All we can really do is share what the Bible teaches and try to live it out for ourselves. -
alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »If losing faith means losing trust...sure. It's an everyday struggle to devote yourself to the will of ? when you feel that your will should be done first.
I can respect the honesty. What makes you regain trust or faith in Jesus again then, considering the doubts you had?
Well...it's understanding that it is normal to feel that way. People get the impression that giving your life to ? is like some 30 day challenge where you do the usual prayers and stuff and you see the results at the end. There should never be a point in this life where you can say you understand the will of ? . That can provoke pride and "pride comes before the fall".
Very interesting, so even up till now, your faith experiences pulls in the opposite direction. My patience is good but when it comes to the supernatural, I tend to expect more and I'm not as patient. I wouldn't call it pride though, people tend to expect a lot from others, and when those expectations fall short, we tend to stop trusting or believing.
Like if I had a friend who I felt was purposefully avoiding me, and never made much effort to contact me, I would assume after awhile that person maybe is not interested in speaking to me or seeing me anymore. When I realized Jesus had no interest in letting himself be seen or visible to those in need, my faith in Christianity became shattered. It's a little bigger then pride in my view, cuz someone like Mother Theresa seemed as humble as it gets, yet her faith became shattered too.
I mean pride in understanding the will of ? . You may have encountered some of us who preach and do so believing they know more than you about the will of ? ...and it reflects in how they try to shame you into coming to faith. It's those people who don't understand what ? intends to do. They don't know how ? is going to use them or how He is going to use the non-believer. Everybody's circumstances in life is unique and it just could be that it won't be us to "save" them. All we can really do is share what the Bible teaches and try to live it out for ourselves.
That's cool, I don't mind people being Christian as long as they're not too pushy with their beliefs or preaching loudly on the subway trains I take. Most Christians aren't like that thankfully, but the ones who are often make the rest look bad. The subway preachers especially.
Otherwise, people have to do what's best for them, assuming they've studied and thought hard long enough to be confident in their path.
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Speaking of people following their paths, the Pope said this weekend he is deeply disturbed at the amount of priests and nuns leaving the church. I wonder what's causing this.....
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/jan/28/pope-frets-about-hemorrhage-priests-nuns-church/
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I thinks it's normal to lose faith in something that doesn't logically exist.
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is the Pope losing faith in ? or Jesus ? because that Jesus ? is the ? that ? everything up making people think he can come and appear to heal people and transform water into wine etc...
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I thinks it's normal to lose faith in something that doesn't logically exist.
It's why I asked in my first post if the Pope is getting a sense of reality that maybe Jesus is not the guy he thought he was. One thing is for sure, Jesus has no plans on removing the Pope's doubts..... -
Ether44mag wrote: »is the Pope losing faith in ? or Jesus ? because that Jesus ? is the ? that ? everything up making people think he can come and appear to heal people and transform water into wine etc...
I think it's mostly clear the Pope is losing faith in Jesus and his abilities, his feelings on ? itself I'm not sure about. Pope Francis knows deep down Jesus can't do much to help people on Earth these days but I wonder as well if he has much faith in any ? at this point. I'm assuming he still has some faith, but the way he's talking lately, I would say any faith he does have is weak. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »Ether44mag wrote: »is the Pope losing faith in ? or Jesus ? because that Jesus ? is the ? that ? everything up making people think he can come and appear to heal people and transform water into wine etc...
I think it's mostly clear the Pope is losing faith in Jesus and his abilities, his feelings on ? itself I'm not sure about. Pope Francis knows deep down Jesus can't do much to help people on Earth these days but I wonder as well if he has much faith in any ? at this point. I'm assuming he still has some faith, but the way he's talking lately, I would say any faith he does have is weak.
like I said earlier tho, He knows the truth ,I think he is acting like he has doubts because alot of people are leaving the religion so he wants them to feel like its normal to doubt , my opinion.
reminds me of when I was a kid and I saw pope john paul II in a parade riding in a bulletproof kind of golf cart smh
how you the Pope and you are scared to die ?? scared to go to heaven and join your friend Jesus ?? ? dont make sense to me ,you cant be the pope and be scared to die because by their logic if you die its because ? says its time so...and plus if you are the pope you suppose to be going straight to heaven right ? so why was he scared ? lol -
Ether44mag wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »Ether44mag wrote: »is the Pope losing faith in ? or Jesus ? because that Jesus ? is the ? that ? everything up making people think he can come and appear to heal people and transform water into wine etc...
I think it's mostly clear the Pope is losing faith in Jesus and his abilities, his feelings on ? itself I'm not sure about. Pope Francis knows deep down Jesus can't do much to help people on Earth these days but I wonder as well if he has much faith in any ? at this point. I'm assuming he still has some faith, but the way he's talking lately, I would say any faith he does have is weak.
like I said earlier tho, He knows the truth ,I think he is acting like he has doubts because alot of people are leaving the religion so he wants them to feel like its normal to doubt , my opinion.
reminds me of when I was a kid and I saw pope john paul II in a parade riding in a bulletproof kind of golf cart smh
how you the Pope and you are scared to die ?? scared to go to heaven and join your friend Jesus ?? ? dont make sense to me ,you cant be the pope and be scared to die because by their logic if you die its because ? says its time so...and plus if you are the pope you suppose to be going straight to heaven right ? so why was he scared ? lol
LOL yeah, maybe Pope John Paul II didn't have much faith in Jesus to protect him directly, although he's supposed to be ? 's "representative" on Earth. I always did laugh at that Popemobile ? , even when I was a Catholic back in the day, I wondered why the Pope would be so scared of heaven. To be fair, he was shot in the 80s so I'll cut him some slack.
I also found it very ironic Paul II ended up with a severe case of Parkinson's. I would think Jesus' representative on Earth would have it better then that, his last many years were said to be painful for him. Kind of weird for a representative of a ? to have it so damn bad. -
Christians have doubts everyday, B.
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Ajackson17 wrote: »Christians have doubts everyday, B.
I wonder if the subway preachers I see a few times a month have those doubts. They always seem pretty sure non-Christians are going to hell for not believing. -
The disciples' faith constantly wavered and they had Jesus right there with them, so I don't think the Pope is saying anything that profound.
