Do You Have A Socialist or Capitalist Mentality?
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Kushington
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Or a mixture of both?
I think the gov. should provide for the downtrodden, but not at the expense of progress
I think the gov. should provide for the downtrodden, but not at the expense of progress
Comments
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both...
but im only for helpin those who help me.. not the helpless... -
Kushington wrote: »Or a mixture of both?
I think the gov. should provide for the downtrodden, but not at the expense of progress
Define your 'progress'. If it's for wealth, you cannot have a socialist mentality and the poor and desperate are just dead weight. If it's for overall well being of a community, city, country, nation, socialism (if applied correctly) would be the way to go. But everyones dream of maybachs and villas who supposedly have a socialist menatility are capitalist at heart. Material greed will always want the strength of capitalism to prosper while those who are trying to make ends meet... well, they will meet their end... -
Both.
I believe things like Health Care and Schooling should be free. We should have social security. There should be government funded programs which will watch your kids if you have a job and can't afford daycare on your salary.
And we should have food stamps, but only to those unemployed.
We need to get rid of welfare and systems like it, invest that money into building new places where they can get jobs and not only make a living, but produce goods here in the United States that we could use, trade, w.e to help out the entire economy on a wider level. -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »Both.
I believe things like Health Care and Schooling should be free. We should have social security. There should be government funded programs which will watch your kids if you have a job and can't afford daycare on your salary.
And we should have food stamps, but only to those unemployed.
We need to get rid of welfare and systems like it, invest that money into building new places where they can get jobs and not only make a living, but produce goods here in the United States that we could use, trade, w.e to help out the entire economy on a wider level.
Very well rounded and balanced response. I completely agree with this. -
its over: 2012! wrote: »I use to feel this way, too. Until I started meeting single dads and even more single mothers, who were in da "Hood working a low-income job that racism had boxed them into.
Yep. Barely able to pay Rent, Lights, Gas, and Phone bill. Therefore, their kid's stomachs stay full of hot-dogs, Ramen noodles, pinto beans, Rice, pork'n'beans, 80%-lean hamburger, chicken Legs, and merely Toast/jelly for breakfast.
Therefore, I think Food-stamps should be made available for employed Americans/family living beneath or near to, whatever Obama's Administration has determined to be the poverty level.
My entire post was a complete system, the bottom line deaded the jobs where you only make enough to decide between lights or food for a month.
And Ramen Noodles.... Hamburger... pork n beans....chicken?
I make a lot every year and those foods stay stocked up in my house. -
its over: 2012! wrote: »FACT: You're a grown man, and my post was mainly directed toward what a growing Kid in da ghetto usually eats, when the parent has a low-paying job. And can't afford healthier/more-expensive grocery shopping.
FACT: Those foods I listed, are not really wholesome nor healthy.
Chicken is pretty healthy -
kingjust627 wrote: »Define your 'progress'. If it's for wealth, you cannot have a socialist mentality and the poor and desperate are just dead weight. If it's for overall well being of a community, city, country, nation, socialism (if applied correctly) would be the way to go. But everyones dream of maybachs and villas who supposedly have a socialist menatility are capitalist at heart. Material greed will always want the strength of capitalism to prosper while those who are trying to make ends meet... well, they will meet their end...
I dont agree....I dont think its entirely impossible to integrate socialism into a capitalist nation, its not done usually due to the preconceived notions of those being helped and uncontrolled greed of preexisting monopolies
But in a utopia, my socialism would consist of free higher education, safe housing for everybody, quality healthcare for everybody,the services available to the rich would be available to the poor, nobody would be left behind due to their economic circumstances....i dont think that would hinder capitalism in any degree, i think that would increase production because everybody would be contributing to their highest potential, the current state of capitalism allows for dead weight because the powers that be arent willing to share
90% of the worlds wealth is held by less than 3% of the worlds population -
Kushington wrote: »I dont agree....I dont think its entirely impossible to integrate socialism into a capitalist nation, its not done usually due to the preconceived notions of those being helped and uncontrolled greed of preexisting monopolies
Sorry, should have been more clear. I'm not saying that IT cannot be done. You and I both understand that those ideals are just that. They have to be implemented by those we put into respective powers. And that is the focal point I was trying to convey. Both ideals are great, but those who inact them, who have control over them, tend to go to extremes with them. You know, to much capitalism equals a huge seperation of income earners, and to much socialism becomes wasteful and services become abused. The irony though is that we see that now... Both ideals being implemented and abused...But in a utopia, my socialism would consist of free higher education, safe housing for everybody, quality healthcare for everybody,the services available to the rich would be available to the poor, nobody would be left behind due to their economic circumstances....i dont think that would hinder capitalism in any degree, i think that would increase production because everybody would be contributing to their highest potential, the current state of capitalism allows for dead weight because the powers that be arent willing to share
Exactly, the unwillingness of those individuals. Another irony is that of all of those services that you mentioned... are possible. If PROFIT wasn't such a HUGE part of capitalism and TOTAL overall WEALTH, things such as free schooling, free healthcare, no discrimination based on incomes for services... those things could be achieved IF the wealthy were not as greedy or as you stated, unwillingly to share. That's why I always stay tax the rich, because they will always be able to afford a loaf of bread during any inflation or recession, but can the average joe do that by being taxed more... i'm sure you know the answer.90% of the worlds wealth is held by less than 3% of the worlds population
And that is what kills me, because they will not be able to have a personal lear, they get all irrate over a miniscual tax increase...
One thing that isn't considered is population growth. With an ever increasing population, there will be a competition for jobs and services. I mean there are to many CHILDREN having children and our system cannot sustain the irresponsible growth that comes from that. But the selfishness of individuals who HAVE to HAVE a baby that don't even consider the children who are already in an overstressed foster care system, maybe they should be taxed more also. China sort of had it right by limiting the populace to 2 seeds per family. They have a huge gap between the well off and the poor. Mostly due, amongst other things, to their population... IMO. -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »Both.
I believe things like Health Care and Schooling should be free. We should have social security. There should be government funded programs which will watch your kids if you have a job and can't afford daycare on your salary.
And we should have food stamps, but only to those unemployed.
We need to get rid of welfare and systems like it, invest that money into building new places where they can get jobs and not only make a living, but produce goods here in the United States that we could use, trade, w.e to help out the entire economy on a wider level.
I agree, theyd rather keep the status quo,welfare/handouts, than allow people to earn a living while contributing
Why outsource jobs when millions of americans need em -
Full on Socialist.
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I believe a mix of both systems gives better prospects and opportunities for all. A democratic socialist would argue that there should be a basic standard of living for all. One of the spoils of citizenship in the richest countries of the world should be guaranteed health care, education and social housing and a safety net to help those that fall.
Now what we have at the moment is a consolidation of too much power in the higher echelons of society, this isn't capitalism, but a form of corporatism, where C.E.O.s get paid over 40x (probably more) the salary of the worker, that doesn't bode well for long term stability. The average person's wage hasn't kept up with inflation, whilst we see poorly run businesses receive corporate welfare and not give anything back to the community. -
100% capitalist mentality. Socialism dont work & capitalism has proven to be immensely successful.
Socialism does work, it just doesnt work for greedy monopolists...I want you to tell me how pure capitalism works when its embedded with the theories of colonalism and oppression, which eventually leads to crime and other social ills, which the state ends up paying for. If they took care of those people from the beginning there wouldnt be any social ills. It would cost less tooIheart~Cali wrote: »Full on Socialist.
You lucky we in the SL, if we was in the G&S I'd definetely throw a sexual innuendo reply lolI believe a mix of both systems gives better prospects and opportunities for all. A democratic socialist would argue that there should be a basic standard of living for all. One of the spoils of citizenship in the richest countries of the world should be guaranteed health care, education and social housing and a safety net to help those that fall.
Now what we have at the moment is a consolidation of too much power in the higher echelons of society, this isn't capitalism, but a form of corporatism, where C.E.O.s get paid over 40x (probably more) the salary of the worker, that doesn't bode well for long term stability. The average person's wage hasn't kept up with inflation, whilst we see poorly run businesses receive corporate welfare and not give anything back to the community.
Yess, you got it. Capitalism is great, but we shouldnt be living in a gilded city surrounded by the destitute. If people want to maintain capitalism, the first step is making sure your workers are satisfied. -
Kushington wrote: »Socialism does work, it just doesnt work for greedy monopolists...I want you to tell me how pure capitalism works when its embedded with the theories of colonalism and oppression, which eventually leads to crime and other social ills, which the state ends up paying for. If they took care of those people from the beginning there wouldnt be any social ills. It would cost less too
Strict Socialism doesn't work great either. There might not be anything that really works of communism and people don't want to live that way. IMO A new breed of socialized living and capitalistic ways should be mixed and tried out, we're losing everything now why not try it anyway.
And Sion out his damn mind. Capitalism doesn't work. Slavery and free work is what made ours work for the longest, then once it ended we had spells of good and bad. The things was before when it went bad America had industries and goods to open up and pick the economy back up. Now we have shut almost everything down or outsourced it and nothing is working. -
It should be obvious by now to any U.S. resident that Capitalism is not successful. Well it's successful for people who are successful I guess, but that doesn't make it a success when our middle class is disappearing.
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Socialist ftw
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But in general capitalism doesnt work ? *looks at Canadian, European, Indian & American economic growth in education, medicine, quality of life, investment & other measures* capitalism is the reason why we have majority of the opportunities we have today. Its an incredible force & wont be stopped in our lifetime.
If you didn't know, what you just mentioned are socialized systems, not capitalism... well partly. Canada and EU have high, and I mean HIGH taxation that affords them to provide those services. -
in north america socialism is a waste of time & would implode. & do i really have to say much more ? look at wat north america & the EU has become thru capitalism (along w/ India whose starting to adopt a more capitalist approach). I think the problem is ppl tryna find a "solution" to capitalism to aid ppl wen in fact theres nothing really wrong with it. Granted there will always be small areas of society & the economy that will be excluded but overall capitalism has provided many opportunities and has built a universal superpower. Social ills & crime will never stop & u and I both know none of the paradigms would help in that area (its in human nature). Imagine if socialism were to replace capitalism & wat the banks and private equity firms would do if they were to merge w/ gov't. Independent/public forms of mass ownership is counter-productive for the economy & the ppl w/ in it. its applications are moreso favorable to areas outside of the economy but even then capitalism is still a more efficient and effective model.
& LMAO @ it not working for greedy monopolists. that was a joke right ? overnight an oligarchy would form and banks, private equity, investment firms would shut down the middle class & suck the poor dry and keep them there for good.
See, why do some people automatically assume crime is a natural occurence? Its not, there would still be deviance, but crime for profit/material gain would cease if people could generate income....THATS human nature.
I dont want socialism to replace capitalism.....but people have to pay taxes anyway, we're already supporting the state, and recieving very little in return.
The state should regulate the economy because its the most profitable sector of the economy(taxes),they already did it when the top companies and CEOs in the mortgage/auto/financial sectors needed help, the idea that the economy is invisible and behaves on its own accord is a myth, people with more money can maniupulate the economy, just like a rapper with a major label can get more promotion than an indie.
My POV is that when people assume poverty and crime will always exist, then it will. You can never have equality in a purely capitalist society because captialism is based on the producer/consumer, worker/owner model
Poor people wont mind being poor if they have what they need -
100% socialism(or what I understand it to be), fee healthcare, education, etc. No one rich, no one poor. Greed and money are the root of all evil and bad things, socialism stops and prevents this.
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I think what isn't working within our system is clear. No jobs, American companies going bankrupt, people paying thousands a year for health care only to be denied an operation by that company, 6,000+ dying from not being able to recieve treatment, multiple disasters over greedy companies, people recieving million dollar bonuses from our tax dollars being sent to keep the company afloat not their yachts. Our policing is terrible, our congress is all bought out by big name companies.You have to be specific with what isnt working.as for things being outsourced thats more of a problem w/ consumption and goods being produced elsewhere and not so much the 2 paradigms. Then again ud have to be a bit more specific b4 i could really tackle that area properly.
Ummm no. Things are outsourced because in a capitalistic system the owners of these companies can quadruple their income by taking a company overseas to places like India and paying the employees 15% of what they pay people here. If the government regulated that ? we would have a large amount of jobs here available.But in general capitalism doesnt work ? *looks at Canadian, European, Indian & American economic growth in education, medicine, quality of life, investment & other measures* capitalism is the reason why we have majority of the opportunities we have today. Its an incredible force & wont be stopped in our lifetime.
Canada, Europe, India are not capitalist countries.
And spare me the American ? , since the 70s we have been on a steady decline in everything. Our quality of life in 12th now, we are 47th on the health care list, we are in the bottom 15 in infant mortality rates, number 32 on the education list. A country so wealthy and so free yet countries like Egypt, Cuba, Chile are higher on lists than we are in terms of healthcare? Have you looked around America? The people in this country are ? morons. 63% of American children couldn't tell you where Britian is on a map.... you don't see something wrong with that? -
LOLOL
You have to be specific with what isnt working.
& as for things being outsourced thats more of a problem w/ consumption and goods being produced elsewhere and not so much the 2 paradigms. Then again ud have to be a bit more specific b4 i could really tackle that area properly.
But in general capitalism doesnt work ? *looks at Canadian, European, Indian & American economic growth in education, medicine, quality of life, investment & other measures* capitalism is the reason why we have majority of the opportunities we have today. Its an incredible force & wont be stopped in our lifetime.
But Canada incorporates many Socialist elements into their economy. Far more than the U.S. Obviously national healthcare. Utilities. I believe certain transportation agencies as well. Things that would never fly here in the States. And even in the midst of a global recession take a look at their deficit and ours. It's appalling.
The countries you listed are subpar in all of those areas by the way. India? Are you joking? And as far as Europe is concerned, alot of the EU countries are Socialist leaning so that's not exactly a fitting example.
The system of Capitalism that we currently have in place might have seemed like a success while the bubble was expanding and everyone was diving in head first. But now that the bubble has popped, you need to step back and reassess your views. If the Capitalist policies were the answer, it would have proven sustainable over the course of our history, not resulting in a disastrous depression like we're experiencing now just as we did 70 years ago. -
@ 1st paragraph - thats an economic problem not a social problem. the necessary stimulus & financial reform was made and overtime things will get back to normal (corporations are going to start hiring again b/c its really whats needed to bring the states out of this recession and back on track 100%). & disasters over greedy companies is an exaggeration - there are way more companies that are doing fine and arent out having oil spills, or other disasters. & w/ the bonus issue - u gotta understand, that dudes class and title of his job entitle him to those types of benefits. Now granted im sure all across the board ppl are takin the lehman bros ex. & are using it to discredit everyone and generalize. But quite frankly the guy who runs a multinational organization responsible for hundreds of thousands of jobs and economic benefit will NOT be paid the same as the guy who works under him. Whether in a socialist setting or capitalist setting you wont EVER see that.
Economic Problem means it is a capitalism issue. And no things will not get back to normal unless we start bringing jobs back into this country. Simple as that.@ 2... this is something that i can argue. If goods are being produced overseas for 70% less than in the homeland why would some1 want to pay the fullprice for them ?? thats why consumption rates of goods are as high as they are. If American business decided to "buy american" and ppl actually went thru just for the sake of its own economy & patriotism it would fall apart tomorrow. The gov't regulating that would definitely NOT help create jobs but rather crumble the institutions that could provide that. b/c how would those companies be able to compete w/ global competition or themselves ?? u gotta see it from both perspectives. Look at places like
And this is the part you don't understand. The good aren't being produced for 70% less and sold cheap here. They are being produced 70% less and being sold the same here.
But for the sake of your pride lets say that is the case. If those jobs were here, the national average on what people are making per hour would be up. So those extra 2-3 dollars per item wouldn't mean anything.
And that last part is simple. We regulate here, keep our goods here, buy from our own country. Why have a middle man when you don't need one.@3.... generalization. Common Sense america is the biggest economy in the world so its numbers are gonna be disproportionate to much smaller ones like cuba & chile. but last time I checked America still had the largest influx of immigrants, the best educational institutions for post secondary education (Harvard, Yale, Stanford, etc.) and more . As for americans being morons ? alright thats a little overboard. I would agree if u said tho that ppl in general are getting dumber across the world.
Again, No America is not the best educational place. Brazil, Italy, Sudan, Russia, Britain, France are just some of those who produce better students with higher IQ's than America and more Scientist. And a lot of immigrants do still come here, because they are still sold on 1950's America. And no across the world people aren't getting dumber. I have read nothing anywhere about global intelligence dropping.overall the American machine is a phenomenal one that has churned out HUGE rewards and has proven to work overtime (look at the 1930s, then look at after WW2, then vietnam, then korea and even the gulf war - most countries that have encountered such events fell apart but America is the only one that has overcome then and still remained a super power) . Every major recession and depression thats occurred throughout the course of american history has always been overcome & shortly afterwards has brought prosperity to all (most)
Look at this
It was built on slavery - Free Labor. High production no cost high reward. That carried America for a while.
After WW2 and the Depression America was producing it's own good. Automobiles, Coal Mines, Steel Mills, Gold. America had alot of goods being produced here and traded from here.
Now it's switched. There is no longer free labor to carry America, There are no longer large industries and large producers working out of here and keeping it here. Asia is killing us in the Automobile department, our Steel Mills are about gone, Gold is no longer being found and shipped at such a high rate.
Do you even know what you're talking about half the time?Socialism as an economic model is not a good choice. B/c when the big banks, private equity & major investment firms merge w/ the state the advantages can be devastating for anyone not intertwined with them higher up the ladder. They'd pretty much have the power to influence ANY industry and buy it out to ascertain control in the blink of an eye.
I never said sole Socialism was great because it isn't. Taxes are way too high and Socialized nations rely too heavily on government for everything and other countries for trade and support. I said we need a mix of the two. People need free schooling, free Health Care, etc... I don't think anyone outside of rich ? will complain about paying more taxes to be able to walk into a hospital for free and receive top care. I don't think anyone would complain about more taxes to walk into the drug store and get there medicine for $6 rather than 200 something.
Capitalism is fine to a point. It needs to be regulated or have it's own production within its system to live off of. Neither do we have. -
I have more of a mutualist mentality. which is an anarchist school of thought that requires a miniscule to no amount of state intervention. and since both socialism and capitalism taken verbatim require a certain scope of government to ensure its survival and to function, my answer to the t/s original question is neither
