Is hov officially the GROAT?
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YesImo yes.
If u look at Hov he's perhaps the most well rounded Mc in the history of hip hop.
Flow, lyrically, storytelling etc.
Lyrically sure some rappers might rate higher (Nas, Gza, etc) but Jay has them on Flow etc this goes for different categories .
21 years since his debut album and about 19yrs at the top without lookin back ain't a Easy feat.
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NoNah Pac the greatest.
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NoIf jay is the most well rounded mc..then what about BIG?..BIG is good at everything! Storytelling,best flow,lyrics,classic albums,radio hits,kills features,selling mad units!..one of the most quoted mcs too...94 to 97...cmon now..3 years only! Jigga is after the king of NY
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NoI have ghostface, nas, sean price, and killah priest ahead of him but overall jigga is the best.
95% of Jay Z fans are ? anyway. Respect to the objective 5%
Jigga warriors>>>>> nastralites -
NoBOSSExcellence wrote: »BOSSExcellence wrote: »BOSSExcellence wrote: »i think ? need to know that there is a difference between great and best..
? dont aways run concurrent..
Mayweather is technically a better boxer than Ali..
but he aint greater than..
jus sayin..
Jay is technically a better rapper than big. But he ain't greater than.
20+ yrs >> 3yrs
Biggie the BoJack of hiphop..
All of that and he doesn't have a better performance than victory, and he doesn't have a better album than ready to die........
When you distill it all the way down to just gettin in the both and rapping.....
Big > Jay
my ? i like Big over Jay..
im not the biggest Jay fan at all..
but c'mo!!? Big aint take hiphop to this level.. Jay did..
this is why Jordan is greater than Kareem but ill slap fire to a ? sayin he better..
Jordan took the NBA to the next level..
Biggie was a ? artist..
as dope as he was he was jus that..
street level ? ..
we talkin about compare that to a ? music mogul who went and owned his own company and was president of the company that owned his conpany..
gettin his masters ownin stakes in a sports team.. big kickin it wit Buffet..
when Hilliary ? ass needed votes they aint call Common..
Jays that ? man..
it aint even nothin to argue..
Jay don't own his masters you tweakin bra… an how he's over accomplished when tha ? never outsold ja rule or dmx facts… -
NoBOSSExcellence wrote: »i jus wanna know what rapper has done more in and for hiphop than JayZ..
since we talkin about GREAT..
and im not askin who's better.. cause Jay aint even my favorite rapper..
You kno jay was 28 when pac n big got smoked …… they were 22 an 23 think about it … -
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Yestrendsetta1030 wrote: »BOSSExcellence wrote: »BOSSExcellence wrote: »BOSSExcellence wrote: »i think ? need to know that there is a difference between great and best..
? dont aways run concurrent..
Mayweather is technically a better boxer than Ali..
but he aint greater than..
jus sayin..
Jay is technically a better rapper than big. But he ain't greater than.
20+ yrs >> 3yrs
Biggie the BoJack of hiphop..
All of that and he doesn't have a better performance than victory, and he doesn't have a better album than ready to die........
When you distill it all the way down to just gettin in the both and rapping.....
Big > Jay
my ? i like Big over Jay..
im not the biggest Jay fan at all..
but c'mo!!? Big aint take hiphop to this level.. Jay did..
this is why Jordan is greater than Kareem but ill slap fire to a ? sayin he better..
Jordan took the NBA to the next level..
Biggie was a ? artist..
as dope as he was he was jus that..
street level ? ..
we talkin about compare that to a ? music mogul who went and owned his own company and was president of the company that owned his conpany..
gettin his masters ownin stakes in a sports team.. big kickin it wit Buffet..
when Hilliary ? ass needed votes they aint call Common..
Jays that ? man..
it aint even nothin to argue..
Jay don't own his masters you tweakin bra… an how he's over accomplished when tha ? never outsold ja rule or dmx facts…
Where were you when he became president of Def Jam? As part of the deal, he negotiated back his masters. The only one that he doesnt solely own is Reasonable Doubt.
Do your googles.
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NoThere IS no GOAT.
But between Jay, Nas, Pac, and BIG...you have the top contenders for it. -
NoThere IS no GOAT.
But between Jay, Nas, Pac, and BIG...you have the top contenders for it.
Rakim also -
No
This is true.
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Notrendsetta1030 wrote: »BOSSExcellence wrote: »BOSSExcellence wrote: »BOSSExcellence wrote: »i think ? need to know that there is a difference between great and best..
? dont aways run concurrent..
Mayweather is technically a better boxer than Ali..
but he aint greater than..
jus sayin..
Jay is technically a better rapper than big. But he ain't greater than.
20+ yrs >> 3yrs
Biggie the BoJack of hiphop..
All of that and he doesn't have a better performance than victory, and he doesn't have a better album than ready to die........
When you distill it all the way down to just gettin in the both and rapping.....
Big > Jay
my ? i like Big over Jay..
im not the biggest Jay fan at all..
but c'mo!!? Big aint take hiphop to this level.. Jay did..
this is why Jordan is greater than Kareem but ill slap fire to a ? sayin he better..
Jordan took the NBA to the next level..
Biggie was a ? artist..
as dope as he was he was jus that..
street level ? ..
we talkin about compare that to a ? music mogul who went and owned his own company and was president of the company that owned his conpany..
gettin his masters ownin stakes in a sports team.. big kickin it wit Buffet..
when Hilliary ? ass needed votes they aint call Common..
Jays that ? man..
it aint even nothin to argue..
Jay don't own his masters you tweakin bra… an how he's over accomplished when tha ? never outsold ja rule or dmx facts…
Jay owns his masters to all his albums except Reasonable Doubt. -
Yestrendsetta1030 wrote: »BOSSExcellence wrote: »i jus wanna know what rapper has done more in and for hiphop than JayZ..
since we talkin about GREAT..
and im not askin who's better.. cause Jay aint even my favorite rapper..
You kno jay was 28 when pac n big got smoked …… they were 22 an 23 think about it …
This is part of the tragedy of their deaths.
But, because they don't have ? past their youth, they can't be GOATs imo. Not when so many other rappers have been around and survived all the changin' sounds. Pac would be Cube now for all we kno' -
No? no.
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YesPac is the greatest overall but as far as being alive in todays hiphop Hov snatches the title because he excels in rap and business better than any rapper alive right now .Master P did it first but JayZ did it better.Period
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yeah but master p was never really rapping like that though. jay is the first ever to do both at a high level.
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1. Kareem is better than Jordan for one simple reason; The objective of basketball is to score the most points. Kareem Abdul Jabbar scored the most points in the history of basketball. Regardless of how many seasons they played, Kareem is the #1 scorer of all time.
2. IMO Big > Jay. But Jay has been doing it for 20+ years. So even though I prefer Big, Jay held it down longer.
3. Jay couldn't beat Nas in a battle.
When its all said and done, Jay has a legitimate claim for the title of GROAT, but its not clear cut.
Also, LL Cool J deserves a nod. -
NoLeBron is the best basketball player ever....he is literally better at everything than Jordan except scoring
In terms of groat
Pac
Nas
Jay-Z
Jay could of better but the 2nd half of his career has but riddled with lackluster projects -
NoAnd karrem is not better then jordan..smh
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NoKareem
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YesLeBron is the best basketball player ever....he is literally better at everything than Jordan except scoring
In terms of groat
Pac
Nas
Jay-Z
Jay could of better but the 2nd half of his career has but riddled with lackluster projects
thats why i said earlier i dont even have Jordan at number 2..
LeBron will go down as the best ever but he aint at Kareem's level yet.. he gotta do it at his pace a few more years as Kareem had..
and i can make an argument that Magic is wven better than Jordan.. itll be hard fought and depended on who im debating i may lose.. but the other two.. nah..
hands down better..
im through arguin this JayZ ? tho.. i lost interest after i woke up..
i dont even ? wit him that heavy like that.
but i respect that man and when he spits i actually take the time out and listen..
Nas jus talkin to be talkin..
he wasnt buyin artwork for 1million 10yrs ago..
perhaps talkin about it.. but actually livin the ? he talked about!!? nah..
same wit Mafioso BIG.. i mean we all listen to music for different reason and take from it different ? ..
but im a realist..
i dont seek music to escape reality.. i need it to sorta define it.. u lose me as a listener when u get to gettin all "lyrical miracle" sayin ? i cant apply or have applied to life..
later on in Jays career i could relate to his ? .. so i ? wit it.. and he aint boring like a Nas..
any ? who think after 20+ years of Jay doin what he's been doin inside and outside of music aint the Greatest and ur choice of artist aint Pac..
u a hater.. -
Nopower_wisdom wrote: »What you keep failing to realize is this ain't sum make believe situation where we don't know who is on who's level we've SEEN Big and Jay perform together and have seen they are equals at worse so to sit here and try and compare songs we can do that all day but bottom line is they've rapped together so to ignore them rapping together and try and go verse for verse song for song or album for album is dumb..... They've been in the booth together multiple times and came out fairly even add that to the fact that Jay has matched him in any aspect of rapping you wanna bring up and he has every right to the claim of GROAT as Big if not more of a claim becuz he's done it at a high level longer
Jay not as good of a storyteller as Big. He is not as creative as Big. His best album wasn't better than Big best album. And most importantly no one ever said he was better than Big when he was alive. Nobody but his circle of friends. Jay is like the under achiever that rarely put in the work. He started out good but then started bullshiting. So when he does do well, people act like it's the best thing ever. Meanwhile you got others who been perform at a super high level all the long. But getting no props, because that's is expected of them. How can you be the best rapper when another rapper ethered you? Talk about impact. Nas made ether a house hold term. How can he be the best when you have a whole list of mcs with better albums? It's about rapping and music. ? that other ? .
Literally everything you said is your opinion and none of it is facts.... I think Jay is just as creative I'll take Jay best album which imo blueprint over Big best album for every person you hear say Jay got ethered you could find someone say takeover was better and wtf do being the best when you come out gotta do with being the best overall??? That makes no sense the ? had only one album at the time and the ? would go down as a classic so what are you talking about.... And to be the best you have to have so kinda of longevity of doing something that's what separates you I mean imagine if every rapper stopped at they second album we'd look at hip hop a whole lot different
Jay checks every box to be the GROAT that don't mean he's #1 in every box no rapper is or else we wouldn't be having this decision but no rapper ever checks more boxes than Jay whether you wanna admit that or not making him the GROAT
? everything you saying opinion not fact. Jay-z and people at the Roc said Nas beat him with Ether.Fact! Stop ? riding. Jay was lyrically his best during RD and Vol1. He dumbed it down after that. According to him. Fact! So if he wasn't better than Big when he was alive at his best lyrical. How is he better than him now? Nas got longevity and has a better discography. Fact! He beat him in a battle. And creatively, lyrically, is better. He is a better story teller, and is versatile with his content. Nas got one wack album. Jay got 5. Do the math.CeLLaR-DooR wrote: »power_wisdom wrote: »What you keep failing to realize is this ain't sum make believe situation where we don't know who is on who's level we've SEEN Big and Jay perform together and have seen they are equals at worse so to sit here and try and compare songs we can do that all day but bottom line is they've rapped together so to ignore them rapping together and try and go verse for verse song for song or album for album is dumb..... They've been in the booth together multiple times and came out fairly even add that to the fact that Jay has matched him in any aspect of rapping you wanna bring up and he has every right to the claim of GROAT as Big if not more of a claim becuz he's done it at a high level longer
Jay not as good of a storyteller as Big. He is not as creative as Big. His best album wasn't better than Big best album. And most importantly no one ever said he was better than Big when he was alive. Nobody but his circle of friends. Jay is like the under achiever that rarely put in the work. He started out good but then started bullshiting. So when he does do well, people act like it's the best thing ever. Meanwhile you got others who been perform at a super high level all the long. But getting no props, because that's is expected of them. How can you be the best rapper when another rapper ethered you? Talk about impact. Nas made ether a house hold term. How can he be the best when you have a whole list of mcs with better albums? It's about rapping and music. ? that other ? .
Like who? Who been doin' it high and not gettin' props? Debates involvin' Jig always turn into this. ? talk like we only rate Jay cah he's popular and don't rate anyone else.
Name them ? who don't get props.
This another thing, no one is sayin' no one else hasnt done ? . The reason we have this discussion is coz there are a number of rappers who could be considered GOAT.
Ether is not a household term.
Jigga is still in the convo if we're just talkin' rappin' and music please let's not allow his other successes to blind us to this commonly held belief.
Common, Nas, Ghostface, Killah Priest, Sean Price, AZ, Mf Doom, KRS, LL, to name a few.
? look at the options to rate a post. It says ether by goat and cosign right? I neaver heard anyone outside of the scientific community say ether before Nas. And even then I only heard it maybe once. ? a hip-hop term now.
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NoBOSSExcellence wrote: »LeBron is the best basketball player ever....he is literally better at everything than Jordan except scoring
In terms of groat
Pac
Nas
Jay-Z
Jay could of better but the 2nd half of his career has but riddled with lackluster projects
thats why i said earlier i dont even have Jordan at number 2..
LeBron will go down as the best ever but he aint at Kareem's level yet.. he gotta do it at his pace a few more years as Kareem had..
and i can make an argument that Magic is wven better than Jordan.. itll be hard fought and depended on who im debating i may lose.. but the other two.. nah..
hands down better..
im through arguin this JayZ ? tho.. i lost interest after i woke up..
i dont even ? wit him that heavy like that.
but i respect that man and when he spits i actually take the time out and listen..
Nas jus talkin to be talkin..
he wasnt buyin artwork for 1million 10yrs ago..
perhaps talkin about it.. but actually livin the ? he talked about!!? nah..
same wit Mafioso BIG.. i mean we all listen to music for different reason and take from it different ? ..
but im a realist..
i dont seek music to escape reality.. i need it to sorta define it.. u lose me as a listener when u get to gettin all "lyrical miracle" sayin ? i cant apply or have applied to life..
later on in Jays career i could relate to his ? .. so i ? wit it.. and he aint boring like a Nas..
any ? who think after 20+ years of Jay doin what he's been doin inside and outside of music aint the Greatest and ur choice of artist aint Pac..
u a hater..
Kareem ain't even the best laker ever
I don't listen to lyrical miracle stuff either unless they are also interesting like nas
But album for album Jay doesn't have an album better than 3 of pacs albums...jay has more let down albums than nas does
You can't tell me that bp2, mchg, kingdom come all aren't supreme trash -
NoLeBron is the best basketball player ever....he is literally better at everything than Jordan except scoring
In terms of groat
Pac
Nas
Jay-Z
Jay could of better but the 2nd half of his career has but riddled with lackluster projects
And winning. And being clutch and dunking. Plus he been in the league since he was 18. 6-0 > 3-5. -
NoI still give that to LL, everybody u think is great was inspired by LL. Who rocked b4 them, wit dem, and after them.
In hiphop to remain relevant through that many changes in styles of music. Not once biting anyone else's flow or persona.
LL da goat
And he had iconic on wax battles that are historic
https://youtube.com/watch?v=ybEZF4Vbe3A
