If the Illuminati Is a Secret Society That Controls the World.....
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who cares if they use the name illuminati or not
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seriously, do you need me to point out why saying "but Wikipedia says all this stuff about the Illuminati" is a TERRIBLE ? argument?blackamerica wrote: »My point is anti-conspiracy advocates want to label anybody who believes in the evidence of the illuminati as "crazy". If we have professors & other very intelligent sources who acknowledge the existence & history of the illuminati, then how can a dumb ? on hip hop website call all these sources "crazy". Is wikipedia not credible? They have a whole page detailing specific information on the illuminati with specific dates & names of people in this organization. Is all this information supposed to be false? Who's the crazy one?
...and none of this changes the fact that you're ignoring my point: whatever support for these conspiracies exists is matched (and topped) by books and professors and whatever else arguing AGAINST the conspiracy. but for some reason, for example, thousands of books that mention a conspiracy prove it exist while thousands of books that call it false are meaningless. you don't see this contradiction?
so let me see if i understand this: the most powerful people in the world gather in secret to perform mock sacrifices where no one else will know ... but wait, who cares if some footage of it gets released on the internet, whateverblackamerica wrote: »The most powerful people in the world gathering in secret performing mock sacrifes & other rituals? Thats a good time to you? All this is backed up w/ pictures & actual footage homie.
huh -
Your missing my overall point.seriously, do you need me to point out why saying "but Wikipedia says all this stuff about the Illuminati" is a TERRIBLE ? argument?
...and none of this changes the fact that you're ignoring my point: whatever support for these conspiracies exists is matched (and topped) by books and professors and whatever else arguing AGAINST the conspiracy. but for some reason, for example, thousands of books that mention a conspiracy prove it exist while thousands of books that call it false are meaningless. you don't see this contradiction?
Dumb ? are quick to say, "? that ? , that illuminati ? ain't real" like its just some myth created against Jayz & Rhianna. They let youtube form they're opinion on whether its real or not, then come rushing in threads like this tryna discredit anything illuminati related (without having read anything on it). MY POINT IS, if your arguing if the illuminati was ever real then your a ? ? giving the fact there's TONS of evidence of it everywhere. The true debate is how much power they have today. Which is what you're referring too. But you can't debate if it was ever real, too much history
Your running from the topic now....so let me see if i understand this: the most powerful people in the world gather in secret to perform mock sacrifices where no one else will know ... but wait, who cares if some footage of it gets released on the internet, whatever
huh
Obviously these pictures were taken without they're knowledge. However, when you have people like you who STILL won't believe these things could ever take place (as if rich people don't lie) then they can continue doing this disgusting ? each year. But just for clarification, do you truly have any knowledge on the Bohemian Club? Have you seen these pictures? Have you actually done enough research to form a critical opinion? What does the huge owl stand for they worship there?
Please educate
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and you're missing mine ... and, actually, compounding it. you're sitting here declaring your proof to be an AMOUNT of evidence - not the quality of it, but the fact that it exists at all. but any damn notion has a book written supporting it and some fool on the internet talking it up. yet at the same time, your average conspiracy theorist talking about THOUSANDS OF BOOKS and COLLEGE PROFESSORS is doing two things:blackamerica wrote: »Your missing my overall point.
01. assuming that people disagreeing with him have read nothing, have nothing supporting them, etc;
02. pretending that the argument they made (thousands of books!!!) doesn't apply in reverse.
dude, you've been furiously dodging my point for days now. let's not call people out for what you're personally doing.blackamerica wrote: »Your running from the topic now....
yeah, but the difference is, I DON'T AGREE WITH YOU about your interpretation of what goes on in various rich dude clubs. i guess that's hard to accept?blackamerica wrote: »But just for clarification, do you truly have any knowledge on the Bohemian Club? Have you seen these pictures? Have you actually done enough research to form a critical opinion? What does the huge owl stand for they worship there? -
I lol when people say the enlightened ones run music.. I'm like so this world controlling group does all this amazing ? but they can't stop Ray Ray nem from bootlegging CDs which cost the industry tons of money? I enjoy the Light
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alvarez_313 wrote: »I lol when people say the enlightened ones run music.. I'm like so this world controlling group does all this amazing ? but they can't stop Ray Ray nem from bootlegging CDs which cost the industry tons of money? I enjoy the Light
They do run the music. Not the illuminati, the capitalists. They own most of the major record companies, and most other media for that matter. This gives them tremendous control over the ideas that the masses are exposed to. Makes propaganda very easy, too. -
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Huh? So your evidence that the illuminati never existed has more "quality" than mine? Really. How do you exactly weigh the quality of my evidence from your evidence? And what books have you read that support your beliefs? Since the quality of information I'm getting doesn't meet your standards.and you're missing mine ... and, actually, compounding it. you're sitting here declaring your proof to be an AMOUNT of evidence - not the quality of it
You can disagree, but your being a chicken ? about it tooyeah, but the difference is, I DON'T AGREE WITH YOU about your interpretation of what goes on in various rich dude clubs. i guess that's hard to accept?
Again, we have photographic evidence as well as FOOTAGE these "rich dudes" are participating in occult rituals at Bohemian Grove. Obviously they weren't aware they were being filmed at the time. You disagree w/ footage now? If I'm wrong then PLEASE tell me your sources that say otherwise. Because you can provide a opinion, but its worthless if you haven't done any research.
Bottom line, you can debate how powerful the Illuminati might be. But if you call me crazy for believing the evidence of their existence, then I'll need y'all evidence saying im crazy.
PS. I can provide plenty of sources if needed
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1 The Illuminati existed. I do not believe anyone argues against this idea. Well documented
2. The original Illuminati disbanded about 10 years after it formed. Well documented
3. Conspiracy theorist contend it continued to survive after it disbanded. Poorly documented.
4. Also it morphed from a group of enlightened men trying to bring down tyranny to a group of powerful men trying to invoke tyranny. Poorly documented or perhaps wildly documented.
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it's pretty telling that you're still not grasping this: my point is that your ill-defined claims do not automatically trump anyone's argument, nor do they mean the person who disagrees with you has not done "research." that's all you conspiracy-loving dudes do: throw out the conspiracy and tell anyone that disagrees to "go do some research." sad, man, sad.blackamerica wrote: »Huh? So your evidence that the illuminati never existed has more "quality" than mine? Really. How do you exactly weigh the quality of my evidence from your evidence? And what books have you read that support your beliefs? Since the quality of information I'm getting doesn't meet your standards.
well, hey, if you wanted to prove to me that i hurt your internet feelings by not immediately cosigning whatever nonsense you're dreaming up, you'd already done that prior to the name calling. oh wait, what's this?blackamerica wrote: »You can disagree, but your being a chicken ? about it too
always with the ? "do some research"blackamerica wrote: »You disagree w/ footage now? If I'm wrong then PLEASE tell me your sources that say otherwise. Because you can provide a opinion, but its worthless if you haven't done any research.
wow, it's almost like you could have done this well before now. especially since the argument here is "prove whatever i claim is wrong"blackamerica wrote: »But if you call me crazy for believing the evidence of their existence, then I'll need y'all evidence saying im crazy.
PS. I can provide plenty of sources if needed
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You have your opinion, I have mine. No argument. I've just politely asked you (overit's pretty telling that you're still not grasping this: my point is that your ill-defined claims do not automatically trump anyone's argument, nor do they mean the person who disagrees with you has not done "research." that's all you conspiracy-loving dudes do: throw out the conspiracy and tell anyone that disagrees to "go do some research." sad, man, sad.
& over) to give me the source of your information that helped you come to the conclusion the Illuminati never existed. What books have you read on it? How much research have you done on this topic? Its a fair question, especially if your so strongly against it
Lol. I'm not upset at all. Just hand over your sources. You claim I'm "dreaming up" my theories, but you have yet to even give me one book you've read about this particular topic.well, hey, if you wanted to prove to me that i hurt your internet feelings by not immediately cosigning whatever nonsense you're dreaming up, you'd already done that prior to the name calling. oh wait, what's this?
Which was exactly my initial point. ? quick to dismiss something as a "crazy conspiracy" then play stupid when you start asking them how they actually came to that opinion. I would never label something crazy if I couldn't provide any source of where I got that assumption
Books you can definitely read:
-Bohemian Grove: Cult of Conspiracy
by Michael Hanson
-Behold a Pale Horse by William Cooper
-Terrorism and the Illuminati: A Three Thousand Year History by David Livingstone
Thanks -
did i say the Illuminati didn't exist? or did i actually take issue with your argument? because i am pretty sure THIS is what i posted:blackamerica wrote: »You have your opinion, I have mine. No argument. I've just politely asked you (over
& over) to give me the source of your information that helped you come to the conclusion the Illuminati never existed.
"you know, why does everyone with so many of their emotions tied up in conspiracy theories always say this? have you never considered that we DID our homework and the ? still sounds crazy? but oh no, THOUSANDS OF BOOKS AND COLLEGE PROFESSORS means no one has never legitimately researched a turbo-secret story you were told and still said, "miss me with that Illuminati ? ."
well, for starters, i have read some of the books you're citing (say, Cooper) and found them to be unpersuasive; same goes for your usual Illuminati theorists (say, Icke), although the more outlandish stuff they pack in (say, aliens). there's a reason why when you look up Bohemian Grove, the first stuff you'll start see is Alex Jones losing his damn mind. if you love him, i GUESS that's cool, but if you don't... which is why i pointed out that sheer volume does not mean quality proof.blackamerica wrote: »Lol. I'm not upset at all. Just hand over your sources. You claim I'm "dreaming up" my theories, but you have yet to even give me one book you've read about this particular topic. Which was exactly my initial point. ? quick to dismiss something as a "crazy conspiracy" then play stupid when you start asking them how they actually came to that opinion.
i used to work with a guy who had almost a crush on that Danny Casolaro character and he'd constantly bring in works in that vein, but after a while, you kind of notice they're all just relying on each other. so 20 books that are all saying the same thing aren't really TWENTY BOOKS, they're 1 argument. and if the argument is unconvincing... -
I think the wording throws people off.
Central banking (NGOs) control the world's currencies (except ~3 countries).
A handful of companies control the media/mainstream entertainment and the MESSAGES people receive.
The private prison industry is in place to incarcerate/enslave for profit.
And much more...
It doesn't matter what you call it.
Just know there's a big ? club and you ain't in it! -
except what 3 countries fam?
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CONSUME OBEY CONSUME OBEY!!!
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N. Korea, Cuba and Iran [I think]. And they're all our "enemies."hiphopjedi wrote: »except what 3 countries fam?
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If you agree the illuminati has existed, then you at the least partially agree w/ me. We can always debate how powerful they are, now. But most ? just got aware of the illuminati through youtube videos about Jayz & Rhianna. Not saying this is you, but a few people on this site. Those are whodid i say the Illuminati didn't exist? or did i actually take issue with your argument? because i am pretty sure THIS is what i posted:
I call lazy
Well for one, I normally stop listening after the aliens stuff. I won't call it crazy per say, but I'm just not convinced. BUT, I don't understand how you can read on the Bohemian Club and not be convinced that there's at the least very weird secretive things bein done by the same elite you think has nothing to hide. I mean, its always good to be objective. But whe (n you have world leaders all dressed in black robes, sacrificial alter & a huge owl over it, one can only believe something ain't right (also reports of weird sexual activities too)well, for starters, i have read some of the books you're citing (say, Cooper) and found them to be unpersuasive; same goes for your usual Illuminati theorists (say, Icke), although the more outlandish stuff they pack in (say, aliens). there's a reason why when you look up Bohemian Grove, the first stuff you'll start see is Alex Jones losing his damn mind. if you love him, i GUESS that's cool, but if you don't... which is why i pointed out that sheer volume does not mean quality proof.
Thats my point lol. If 20 books are saying the same thing about one elite group, then I'm siding with the 20 books. You can always differ. But until you find 20 more books arguing against it, how can you call your conclusion a logical one?i used to work with a guy who had almost a crush on that Danny Casolaro character and he'd constantly bring in works in that vein, but after a while, you kind of notice they're all just relying on each other. so 20 books that are all saying the same thing aren't really TWENTY BOOKS, they're 1 argument. and if the argument is unconvincing..[B/]. -
it's not that i "agree the Illuminati has existed" as much as i don't think it's worth arguing THAT point because the definition of what the Illuminati IS can vary so wildly.blackamerica wrote: »If you agree the illuminati has existed, then you at the least partially agree w/ me. We can always debate how powerful they are, now. But most ? just got aware of the illuminati through youtube videos about Jayz & Rhianna. Not saying this is you, but a few people on this site. Those are who
I call lazy
the thing is, "weird and secretive" ALSO covers a lot of weird stuff that DOESN'T involve mysterious religions and/or conspiracies. there are a lot of really weird people out there, and some of them are rich, super-powerful people who hang out together. do i understand WHY that makes people suspicious? sure. but i think i want a little more than just saying "we filmed these rich dudes acting weird."blackamerica wrote: »Well for one, I normally stop listening after the aliens stuff. I won't call it crazy per say, but I'm just not convinced. BUT, I don't understand how you can read on the Bohemian Club and not be convinced that there's at the least very weird secretive things bein done by the same elite you think has nothing to hide. I mean, its always good to be objective. But whe (n you have world leaders all dressed in black robes, sacrificial alter & a huge owl over it, one can only believe something ain't right (also reports of weird sexual activities too)
well... it's not really your point, if you look at that post. one unconvincing argument repeated 20 times is still ONE unconvincing argument.blackamerica wrote: »Thats my point lol. If 20 books are saying the same thing about one elite group, then I'm siding with the 20 books. You can always differ. But until you find 20 more books arguing against it, how can you call your conclusion a logical one?
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I think rich people hang out with other rich people and they influence each other and the govt to work how they want it to work. I don't necessarily think they have a name or group meeting....
I know they probably trade secrets on how to make more money and don't give a ? about anyone else. -
A secret elite group of powerful organizations secretly plotting for world dominance without the mass public's knowledge. Its not really much of a conspiracy. Its only when you use the word "Illuminati" people get defensive.it's not that i "agree the Illuminati has existed" as much as i don't think it's worth arguing THAT point because the definition of what the Illuminati IS can vary so wildly.
If acting weird requires mock sacrifices & strange sexual activities then thats all you should need. Again, these things have been well documented and backed up with photographic proof. You can't convince somebody the sky's blue if they've already convinced themselves its not. You've already made your mind up that things like this couldn't ever happen, before considering all the information. Its typical anti-conspiracy theoriststhe thing is, "weird and secretive" ALSO covers a lot of weird stuff that DOESN'T involve mysterious religions and/or conspiracies. there are a lot of really weird people out there, and some of them are rich, super-powerful people who hang out together. do i understand WHY that makes people suspicious? sure. but i think i want a little more than just saying "we filmed these rich dudes acting weird."[B/]
You see, there you go. You've ALREADY decided one sides unconvincing before you even gathered all the information lol. Thats the difference between us. I'll look at ALL theories and THEN determine which side I stand on. While ? like you take a position before any of the information presents itself.well... it's not really your point, if you look at that post. one unconvincing argument repeated 20 times is still ONE unconvincing argument. -
? up thing is, there ARE gov'ts, shady banks, and mega-corporations doing truly nasty evil ? in the world but ? don't know ? about it because they'd rather focus they energy on some fantasy illuminati ? instead.
They'll recite 100 reasons the illuminati wanted Michael Jackson dead, but ask them about how banks stole $500 TRILLION in the Libor scandal or how about Shell Oil murdered Ken Saro-Wiwa and they will stare at you blankly.
? sad. -
There is no group or super evil. These are just merely fantasies.
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BlackxChild wrote: »I think rich people hang out with other rich people and they influence each other and the govt to work how they want it to work. I don't necessarily think they have a name or group meeting....
I know they probably trade secrets on how to make more money and don't give a ? about anyone else.
That sounds like any cocktail party in Georgetown in D.C., Manhattan's Upper Eastside, Pacific Heights in the 'Sco, or a tech convention in the Silicon Valley. -
I'm not sure who this is aimed at, but this falls in line with my points. Its only the word "illuminati" that throws people off. Who knows what they call themselves? The point is among the shady gov'ts, bankers & greedy corporations, is it really crazy to assume a selective few haven't linked up in secret? Who owns these banks? Who owns the media? Who funds wars & profits from them? You call the illuminati "fantasy" but that fact is there already embedded in American history.Swiffness! wrote: »? up thing is, there ARE gov'ts, shady banks, and mega-corporations doing truly nasty evil ? in the world but ? don't know ? about it because they'd rather focus they energy on some fantasy illuminati ? instead.
They'll recite 100 reasons the illuminati wanted Michael Jackson dead, but ask them about how banks stole $500 TRILLION in the Libor scandal or how about Shell Oil murdered Ken Saro-Wiwa and they will stare at you blankly.
? sad.
Now are the history books "fantasy" too?
http://youtu.be/MfPiN0RlbK0
