LEVIATHAN : A ROOKIE JUMPS DIRECTLY IN THE LEMZOLA EXPERIENCE feat MANSAMUSA & OCEANIC
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Leviathan616 wrote: »For one, worshipping (or whatever you want to call it) the dark force but not the other.. while at the same time acknowledging that both it and the light force spring from the same [greater] source (that is not worshipped either) has not been properly explained.
The reason why the dark force is worshipped is just to realize that it's a part of humanity, and sometimes embracing it will lead to emotional gratification.
But the question is, why it over the light or even the source of both since the light and dark forces are essentially manifestations of the same oneness, so to speak. You've said they are OF nature. Wouldn't that mean nature works through these dialectical forces? Why not worship both since one relatively exists only because of the other? -
Leviathan616 wrote: »MansaMusa67 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »MansaMusa67 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »MansaMusa67 wrote: »Kinda....not kids my bad
Karma is basically the direction of emotional energy and deeds as we don't believe in afterlifes or reincarnation. Karma to a LaVeyan Satanist means quid pro quo, and an eye for a eye. If you are good to me then I direct positive energy your way by repaying in kind. If you are malicious to me then I direct negative energy to you, appropriate for the deed to teach you a lesson.
im sorry if im not phrasing my question right but I think im confusing u...
so based on this post...karma is viewed as the justifiable outcome of events in a persons life based on the actions of said individual...
so if someone kills ur brother...."karma" would b the retaliation by u or other family members...
But my question is what is the point of the ritual? Maybe im missing something....
I realized I used the wrong term. It's more of a cause and effect. Sometimes when the risks of retaliation outweighs the benefits, then the destruction ritual would serve as an outlet for all the negative emotional energy. Now for a Satanist that has nothing to lose from the consequences of said action, then he could feel free to retaliate, using the destruction ritual to focus their mind and emotions on carrying out revenge. We also believe that sometimes you have to let things go if it consumes to much of your time, effort, energy, or resources.
This....
In what way does the destruction ritual "prepare" the mind to carry out the deed of retaliation?
Well music is an important part of the ritual to set the atmosphere. Any kind of angry music can focus your mind state. Some practicioners fashion themselves a doll in the likeness of the target, some use a photograph. You either torture the doll, or burn the photo in the flame of the candles, after doing the chant. Sometimes just performing this ritual is enough for practicioners, and they no longer seek to carry out retaliation, because the negative energy has been left at the alter. If they still feel like they need to retaliate, then they come up with a plan. As for my spouse, he's not a Satanist. He follows the beliefs of his Indian culture, so he's a naturalist. I personally haven't performed a destruction ritual because I felt like I didn't need to do that to handle my enemies. There is not a requirement to participate and perform rituals.
Thank you for your honesty. You've answered all my questions and I really don't have anything else to ask.
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Leviathan616 wrote: »For one, worshipping (or whatever you want to call it) the dark force but not the other.. while at the same time acknowledging that both it and the light force spring from the same [greater] source (that is not worshipped either) has not been properly explained.
The reason why the dark force is worshipped is just to realize that it's a part of humanity, and sometimes embracing it will lead to emotional gratification.
But the question is, why it over the light or even the source of both since the light and dark forces are essentially manifestations of the same oneness, so to speak. You've said they are OF nature. Wouldn't that mean nature works through these dialectical forces? Why not worship both since one relatively exists only because of the other?
That's where I have my qualms with the philosophy. It is true that both of them come from nature, and both of them should be worshiped, instead of placing emphasis on the dark. That's why as time passes on, I consider myself more of an LHPer than a LaVeyan. Honestly in my opinion, I think that LaVey was just trying to get people comfortable with the dark force instead of just shunning it, that's why it's emphasized so much in the philosophy. It's also because of the historical context too, because he founded the philosophy in 1966, and the majority of the country were Christians. Out of balance, yes indeed, but every philosophy has it's faults and shortcomings.
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Leviathan616 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »For one, worshipping (or whatever you want to call it) the dark force but not the other.. while at the same time acknowledging that both it and the light force spring from the same [greater] source (that is not worshipped either) has not been properly explained.
The reason why the dark force is worshipped is just to realize that it's a part of humanity, and sometimes embracing it will lead to emotional gratification.
But the question is, why it over the light or even the source of both since the light and dark forces are essentially manifestations of the same oneness, so to speak. You've said they are OF nature. Wouldn't that mean nature works through these dialectical forces? Why not worship both since one relatively exists only because of the other?
That's where I have my qualms with the philosophy. It is true that both of them come from nature, and both of them should be worshiped, instead of placing emphasis on the dark. That's why as time passes on, I consider myself more of an LHPer than a LaVeyan. Honestly in my opinion, I think that LaVey was just trying to get people comfortable with the dark force instead of just shunning it, that's why it's emphasized so much in the philosophy. It's also because of the historical context too, because he founded the philosophy in 1966, and the majority of the country were Christians. Out of balance, yes indeed, but every philosophy has it's faults and shortcomings.
I see. So if you were to abandon a philosophy that places emphasis on the dark force, would you no longer be considered a Satanist? Sorry if I missed it; what's a Left Hand Pather? -
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Leviathan616 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »For one, worshipping (or whatever you want to call it) the dark force but not the other.. while at the same time acknowledging that both it and the light force spring from the same [greater] source (that is not worshipped either) has not been properly explained.
The reason why the dark force is worshipped is just to realize that it's a part of humanity, and sometimes embracing it will lead to emotional gratification.
But the question is, why it over the light or even the source of both since the light and dark forces are essentially manifestations of the same oneness, so to speak. You've said they are OF nature. Wouldn't that mean nature works through these dialectical forces? Why not worship both since one relatively exists only because of the other?
That's where I have my qualms with the philosophy. It is true that both of them come from nature, and both of them should be worshiped, instead of placing emphasis on the dark. That's why as time passes on, I consider myself more of an LHPer than a LaVeyan. Honestly in my opinion, I think that LaVey was just trying to get people comfortable with the dark force instead of just shunning it, that's why it's emphasized so much in the philosophy. It's also because of the historical context too, because he founded the philosophy in 1966, and the majority of the country were Christians. Out of balance, yes indeed, but every philosophy has it's faults and shortcomings.
I see. So if you were to abandon a philosophy that places emphasis on the dark force, would you no longer be considered a Satanist? Sorry if I missed it; what's a Left Hand Pather?
No, you would just be considered an Self-Styled or Independent Satanist as you embrace both forces without shunning either. That can include Theistic Satanism. A Left Hand Pather is one who rejects social convention and the status quo, embraces magical techniques that would be viewed as taboo, such as sex magick or embracing Satanic Imagery, questions moral or religious dogma, and embraces sexuality. Some people equate it with Black Magic.
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MansaMusa67 wrote: »
Nah... -
Leviathan616 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »For one, worshipping (or whatever you want to call it) the dark force but not the other.. while at the same time acknowledging that both it and the light force spring from the same [greater] source (that is not worshipped either) has not been properly explained.
The reason why the dark force is worshipped is just to realize that it's a part of humanity, and sometimes embracing it will lead to emotional gratification.
But the question is, why it over the light or even the source of both since the light and dark forces are essentially manifestations of the same oneness, so to speak. You've said they are OF nature. Wouldn't that mean nature works through these dialectical forces? Why not worship both since one relatively exists only because of the other?
That's where I have my qualms with the philosophy. It is true that both of them come from nature, and both of them should be worshiped, instead of placing emphasis on the dark. That's why as time passes on, I consider myself more of an LHPer than a LaVeyan. Honestly in my opinion, I think that LaVey was just trying to get people comfortable with the dark force instead of just shunning it, that's why it's emphasized so much in the philosophy. It's also because of the historical context too, because he founded the philosophy in 1966, and the majority of the country were Christians. Out of balance, yes indeed, but every philosophy has it's faults and shortcomings.
I see. So if you were to abandon a philosophy that places emphasis on the dark force, would you no longer be considered a Satanist? Sorry if I missed it; what's a Left Hand Pather?
No, you would just be considered an Self-Styled or Independent Satanist as you embrace both forces without shunning either. That can include Theistic Satanism. A Left Hand Pather is one who rejects social convention and the status quo, embraces magical techniques that would be viewed as taboo, such as sex magick or embracing Satanic Imagery, questions moral or religious dogma, and embraces sexuality. Some people equate it with Black Magic.
Cool. I'm the same way, but I don't consider myself a Satanist cuz I don't practice black magic and all of that. However, I do study world religions that line up somewhat with my naturalistic viewpoints, e.g. Taoism, Buddhism, African and Native American spiritualities.
I can respect that. I don't have anything else to say since you've answered my primary questions well enough for me to understand your perspective. -
You should visit the R&R sometime. Join me on my crusade against the evil forces of Christianity, Judaism and Islam.
(of course I was slightly joking on that last sentence. It's not so much of a crusade as it is once in a blue moon intelligent debates) -
Leviathan616 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »For one, worshipping (or whatever you want to call it) the dark force but not the other.. while at the same time acknowledging that both it and the light force spring from the same [greater] source (that is not worshipped either) has not been properly explained.
The reason why the dark force is worshipped is just to realize that it's a part of humanity, and sometimes embracing it will lead to emotional gratification.
But the question is, why it over the light or even the source of both since the light and dark forces are essentially manifestations of the same oneness, so to speak. You've said they are OF nature. Wouldn't that mean nature works through these dialectical forces? Why not worship both since one relatively exists only because of the other?
That's where I have my qualms with the philosophy. It is true that both of them come from nature, and both of them should be worshiped, instead of placing emphasis on the dark. That's why as time passes on, I consider myself more of an LHPer than a LaVeyan. Honestly in my opinion, I think that LaVey was just trying to get people comfortable with the dark force instead of just shunning it, that's why it's emphasized so much in the philosophy. It's also because of the historical context too, because he founded the philosophy in 1966, and the majority of the country were Christians. Out of balance, yes indeed, but every philosophy has it's faults and shortcomings.
I see. So if you were to abandon a philosophy that places emphasis on the dark force, would you no longer be considered a Satanist? Sorry if I missed it; what's a Left Hand Pather?
No, you would just be considered an Self-Styled or Independent Satanist as you embrace both forces without shunning either. That can include Theistic Satanism. A Left Hand Pather is one who rejects social convention and the status quo, embraces magical techniques that would be viewed as taboo, such as sex magick or embracing Satanic Imagery, questions moral or religious dogma, and embraces sexuality. Some people equate it with Black Magic.
Cool. I'm the same way, but I don't consider myself a Satanist cuz I don't practice black magic and all of that. However, I do study world religions that line up somewhat with my naturalistic viewpoints, e.g. Taoism, Buddhism, African and Native American spiritualities.
I can respect that. I don't have anything else to say since you've answered my primary questions well enough for me to understand your perspective.
You don't have to necessarily be a Satanist to practice Black Magic. Some sects of Wicca embrace Black Magic as it considered magic performed for selfish or evil purposes. I will take you up on that offer though.
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The other 9 times out of 10 we like to ? on each other's religion and be immature about race relations so be forewarned. All in all, it's entertaining to say the least.
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Leviathan616 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »For one, worshipping (or whatever you want to call it) the dark force but not the other.. while at the same time acknowledging that both it and the light force spring from the same [greater] source (that is not worshipped either) has not been properly explained.
The reason why the dark force is worshipped is just to realize that it's a part of humanity, and sometimes embracing it will lead to emotional gratification.
But the question is, why it over the light or even the source of both since the light and dark forces are essentially manifestations of the same oneness, so to speak. You've said they are OF nature. Wouldn't that mean nature works through these dialectical forces? Why not worship both since one relatively exists only because of the other?
That's where I have my qualms with the philosophy. It is true that both of them come from nature, and both of them should be worshiped, instead of placing emphasis on the dark. That's why as time passes on, I consider myself more of an LHPer than a LaVeyan. Honestly in my opinion, I think that LaVey was just trying to get people comfortable with the dark force instead of just shunning it, that's why it's emphasized so much in the philosophy. It's also because of the historical context too, because he founded the philosophy in 1966, and the majority of the country were Christians. Out of balance, yes indeed, but every philosophy has it's faults and shortcomings.
I see. So if you were to abandon a philosophy that places emphasis on the dark force, would you no longer be considered a Satanist? Sorry if I missed it; what's a Left Hand Pather?
No, you would just be considered an Self-Styled or Independent Satanist as you embrace both forces without shunning either. That can include Theistic Satanism. A Left Hand Pather is one who rejects social convention and the status quo, embraces magical techniques that would be viewed as taboo, such as sex magick or embracing Satanic Imagery, questions moral or religious dogma, and embraces sexuality. Some people equate it with Black Magic.
Cool. I'm the same way, but I don't consider myself a Satanist cuz I don't practice black magic and all of that. However, I do study world religions that line up somewhat with my naturalistic viewpoints, e.g. Taoism, Buddhism, African and Native American spiritualities.
I can respect that. I don't have anything else to say since you've answered my primary questions well enough for me to understand your perspective.
You don't have to necessarily be a Satanist to practice Black Magic. Some sects of Wicca embrace Black Magic as it considered magic performed for selfish or evil purposes. I will take you up on that offer though.
Doesn't interest me enough. Closest I've ever came to that has been my study of herbalism. I'm still learning in that area though. -
The other 9 times out of 10 we like to ? on each other's religion and be immature about race relations so be forewarned. All in all, it's entertaining to say the least.
It's pretty much the same across most of the internet. I've been in plenty of other forums where those actions have transpired. A Satanist is one that admires the character of Satan symbolically or one who worships him a deity. You don't have to be a Satanist to be a Left Hand Pather, as those are not one in the same. The LHP just employs those practices.
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Leviathan616 wrote: »The other 9 times out of 10 we like to ? on each other's religion and be immature about race relations so be forewarned. All in all, it's entertaining to say the least.
It's pretty much the same across most of the internet. I've been in plenty of other forums where those actions have transpired. A Satanist is one that admires the character of Satan symbolically or one who worships him a deity. You don't have to be a Satanist to be a Left Hand Pather, as those are not one in the same. The LHP just employs those practices.
Do you know much of anything about Taoism? -
Leviathan616 wrote: »The other 9 times out of 10 we like to ? on each other's religion and be immature about race relations so be forewarned. All in all, it's entertaining to say the least.
It's pretty much the same across most of the internet. I've been in plenty of other forums where those actions have transpired. A Satanist is one that admires the character of Satan symbolically or one who worships him a deity. You don't have to be a Satanist to be a Left Hand Pather, as those are not one in the same. The LHP just employs those practices.
Do you know much of anything about Taoism?
No, but I'm always interested in expanding my philosophical outlook.
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I can't explain It all here but I would invest in a copy of the Tao te Ching, preferably the translation and commentary by Ellen Chen.Leviathan616 wrote: »Leviathan616 wrote: »The other 9 times out of 10 we like to ? on each other's religion and be immature about race relations so be forewarned. All in all, it's entertaining to say the least.
It's pretty much the same across most of the internet. I've been in plenty of other forums where those actions have transpired. A Satanist is one that admires the character of Satan symbolically or one who worships him a deity. You don't have to be a Satanist to be a Left Hand Pather, as those are not one in the same. The LHP just employs those practices.
Do you know much of anything about Taoism?
No, but I'm always interested in expanding my philosophical outlook. -
I think it would be beneficial to your spirituality.
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I think it would be beneficial to your spirituality.
Thanks, because spirituality is a journey.
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Leviathan616 wrote: »
Agreed. That's why I've been interested in asking you those questions. I'm still journeying, myself. What else have you studied or been involved in besides Satanism -
Leviathan616 wrote: »
Agreed. That's why I've been interested in asking you those questions. I'm still journeying, myself. What else have you studied or been involved in besides Satanism
I've been involved in Christianity when I was younger, because I was raised in the church. My denomination was Missionary Baptist. I've studied Nihilism, and I am currently studying Astrology.
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I was also raised Baptist. I turned away from the religion in my early 20s after the realization that the ? theory is illogical and that natural phenomena can be fully explained in a non theistic way.
After that, I began searching for my own answers. Looking back, I can see that my faith was more fear. I was indoctrinated as a child. I never felt much about church personally. It seemed to be an obligation, not a relationship as others claimed.
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I agree. I also didn't agree with Christianity's stance on women and other social issues.
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Leviathan616 wrote: »social issues.
Such as?
I've seen that you favor retaliation and get-back. Do you think that this method is the best option in all possible scenarios?
For example, I view human action to be something like throwing a rock in a pond. The after effects not only harm or benefit others but the ripples, or in this allegory the energy you give off to the universe, coffee back to the one who's done the deed. -
Come back*
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Leviathan616 wrote: »social issues.
Such as?
I've seen that you favor retaliation and get-back. Do you think that this method is the best option in all possible scenarios?
For example, I view human action to be something like throwing a rock in a pond. The after effects not only harm or benefit others but the ripples, or in this allegory the energy you give off to the universe, coffee back to the one who's done the deed.
Women freedom of choice, the stance on homosexuality, and ? marriage. As for retaliation, I realize that it is not the best option all the time. I believe that if it takes too much of your time, effort, energy, resources, or if you risk being incarcerated, then you have to let it go. I value my freedom too much, as that is promoted in the Satanic philosophy. I'm going to have to wrap this up for the night. TTYL.
