In about 50 years ? will be phased out.
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I love living I love going through the process of life. Why the ? do I need a ? to want to live the life I have.
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Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
Right, the one in the Holy Bible, the one Christians believe in. Jehovah, Jesus etc...
Then I'll keep it simple and stick with two of the more important ten commandments, Yahweh frowns upon theft and murder. If that is the case, then why do theft and murder still happen? Theoretically, an omnipotent being would be able to end both effortlessly if he/she/it wanted to. Sure, you could bring up our supposed free will, but that directly conflicts with the idea of omniscience and omnipotence in a more roundabout way (not to mention Yahweh overrode the Pharaoh's free will when he felt like it). Frankly, Yahweh doesn't come off as triple omni in any of the religious texts he is featured in. Very powerful? Sure. Very Knowledgeable? Certainly. But neither attribute seemed absolute.
Theft and murder happen because he gave humans the right to decide if they want to thieve and ? .
How is being able to create beings and give them their own ability to choose actions a conflict with the creator being all powerful.
You thinks he's less powerful because he gave us the ability to do what we want as opposed to controlling our every move?
but ? is omnipresent so what we do is his doing. We only do what he allows us to do. (to an omnipotent being) Allowing to do = Committing the act
But he allows us to do ANYTHING we want.
If you walk in my house and say can i ? your roommate, and I say yes, I won't stop you. And you do it. Am I charged for murder? No. Allowing =/= Committing the act.
If someone knocks on your door and asks you to use your roof to assassinate someone and you allow them to do it, you will be charged -
Theft and murder happen because he gave humans the right to decide if they want to thieve and ? .
How is being able to create beings and give them their own ability to choose actions a conflict with the creator being all powerful.
One of the implications of omnipotence is that your will is absolute. Nothing happens unless you want it to happen. If that is the case, then how can our will trump his?You thinks he's less powerful because he gave us the ability to do what we want as opposed to controlling our every move?
If he truly wants us to be "good", then yes, it makes him less powerful. Now hypothetically, this could all be of Yahweh's will, but given the state of the world and our history, he wouldn't exactly be the beneficent deity that many believe him to be.
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There is no free will, it contradicts scripture and ? itself.
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Jaded Righteousness wrote: »Jaded Righteousness wrote: »he's the company that makes the system, and the video game system is advanced enough to choose if it wants to be faulty or work perfectly.
the video game does exactly what the programmer wants it to do. If it doesn't it's the programmer's fault and most likely, he'll have a short career if he keeps it up
See, you are trying to compare something of extremely limited AI (such as video games) to something as complex as a human being.
Poor analogy.
It wasn't my analogy, smart guy. It was yours.
Both computers and humans (as you clearly show) have limited "intelligence"
No actually, someone else had originally brought up the video game analogy, I just continued along for his sake.
If you knew it was a poor analogy from the get-go, why use it to formulate an argument? If you were omniscient, maybe you would know better. Maybe not, though cuz your ? supposedly creates beings and sends them to hell if they're faulty when he already knows the results beforehand -
Astro King answe my question since I asked your ? question on why I want to live.
Do you believe that one man built a big ass boat and fought Crocodiles and ? to put 2 of every animal on a boat?
Do you believe a man can live in a ? damn fish? -
Jaded Righteousness wrote: »Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
Right, the one in the Holy Bible, the one Christians believe in. Jehovah, Jesus etc...
Then I'll keep it simple and stick with two of the more important ten commandments, Yahweh frowns upon theft and murder. If that is the case, then why do theft and murder still happen? Theoretically, an omnipotent being would be able to end both effortlessly if he/she/it wanted to. Sure, you could bring up our supposed free will, but that directly conflicts with the idea of omniscience and omnipotence in a more roundabout way (not to mention Yahweh overrode the Pharaoh's free will when he felt like it). Frankly, Yahweh doesn't come off as triple omni in any of the religious texts he is featured in. Very powerful? Sure. Very Knowledgeable? Certainly. But neither attribute seemed absolute.
Theft and murder happen because he gave humans the right to decide if they want to thieve and ? .
How is being able to create beings and give them their own ability to choose actions a conflict with the creator being all powerful.
You thinks he's less powerful because he gave us the ability to do what we want as opposed to controlling our every move?
but ? is omnipresent so what we do is his doing. We only do what he allows us to do. (to an omnipotent being) Allowing to do = Committing the act
But he allows us to do ANYTHING we want.
If you walk in my house and say can i ? your roommate, and I say yes, I won't stop you. And you do it. Am I charged for murder? No. Allowing =/= Committing the act.
If someone knocks on your door and asks you to use your roof to assassinate someone and you allow them to do it, you will be charged
Doesn't matter though anyway because I'm referring to a being who is omnipotent. You are not omnipotent.
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Jaded Righteousness wrote: »Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
Right, the one in the Holy Bible, the one Christians believe in. Jehovah, Jesus etc...
Then I'll keep it simple and stick with two of the more important ten commandments, Yahweh frowns upon theft and murder. If that is the case, then why do theft and murder still happen? Theoretically, an omnipotent being would be able to end both effortlessly if he/she/it wanted to. Sure, you could bring up our supposed free will, but that directly conflicts with the idea of omniscience and omnipotence in a more roundabout way (not to mention Yahweh overrode the Pharaoh's free will when he felt like it). Frankly, Yahweh doesn't come off as triple omni in any of the religious texts he is featured in. Very powerful? Sure. Very Knowledgeable? Certainly. But neither attribute seemed absolute.
Theft and murder happen because he gave humans the right to decide if they want to thieve and ? .
How is being able to create beings and give them their own ability to choose actions a conflict with the creator being all powerful.
You thinks he's less powerful because he gave us the ability to do what we want as opposed to controlling our every move?
but ? is omnipresent so what we do is his doing. We only do what he allows us to do. (to an omnipotent being) Allowing to do = Committing the act
But he allows us to do ANYTHING we want.
If you walk in my house and say can i ? your roommate, and I say yes, I won't stop you. And you do it. Am I charged for murder? No. Allowing =/= Committing the act.
If someone knocks on your door and asks you to use your roof to assassinate someone and you allow them to do it, you will be charged
But you would not get charged for murder, it would be accomplice to murder if indeed it can even be proven.
But thats getting off track, omnipresent is being PRESENT everywhere, not being everything. If still going by the Bible, ? created us in his image, it didn;'t say ? created billions of himself.
Nowhere in the Bible does it insinuate we, humans, are HIM. -
Yes. It it WASNT free, it wouldnt be allowed to CHOOSE. Regardless of whether the company knows or not.
But if the company knows, then is the system truly free, or does it merely believe that it is free?
And if the company knows a product will be faulty before it produces it, then it is a shoddy manufacturer.
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But he allows us to do ANYTHING we want.
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which makes no sense. He is omnipresent/omnipotent so our act is his act
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Astro King watch this and answer my question
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o&feature=youtube_gdata_player
? is a really ? ? for allowing some of the ? he does.... Why did he create the Devil if he knew he was going to be evil which according to the bible he knew.. -
Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
This is an excellent article to read on that and it would say everything I would say:
http://carm.org/if-? -all-powerful-and-loving-why-there-suffering-world
A strong theme there is that ? gave us free will. And anything contrary to ? is evil. Therefore whenever we act against ? , we are committing evil. Therefore, that is where evil comes from.
Why isn't ? held accountable for the evil men that are born? He made the everything, did he not? That's like saying if company made a console that's faulty, that it's on the console not the company or the developer?
You can't surely agree with this.
He made everything, including creating free will. If he's omnipotent, he could've created us to be a slave army of robots, programmed to do his bidding. Free will is what lets us choose our actions, thoughts and beliefs. So basically, he's the company that makes the system, and the video game system is advanced enough to choose if it wants to be faulty or work perfectly.
I think people do what because they can not because we have free will in planted in us. Why create such an evil character if you know they're going to hell?
You think everyone "evil" is evil from birth? You think ? came out the ? with a vengeance for Jews? No, usually something happened in their life to instill whatever hatred was manifested.
For me to sit here and act like I know WHY ? created people or what his plan is would be stupid lol. But whose to say that everyone ? creates is supposed to go to heaven, but the choices they make with free will may lead them to hell? -
Jaded Righteousness wrote: »Jaded Righteousness wrote: »Jaded Righteousness wrote: »he's the company that makes the system, and the video game system is advanced enough to choose if it wants to be faulty or work perfectly.
the video game does exactly what the programmer wants it to do. If it doesn't it's the programmer's fault and most likely, he'll have a short career if he keeps it up
See, you are trying to compare something of extremely limited AI (such as video games) to something as complex as a human being.
Poor analogy.
It wasn't my analogy, smart guy. It was yours.
Both computers and humans (as you clearly show) have limited "intelligence"
No actually, someone else had originally brought up the video game analogy, I just continued along for his sake.
If you knew it was a poor analogy from the get-go, why use it to formulate an argument? If you were omniscient, maybe you would know better. Maybe not, though cuz your ? supposedly creates beings and sends them to hell if they're faulty when he already knows the results beforehand
Lmao, catching feelings are we?
I countered a poor analogy so the person who used the poor analogy could understand. It wasn't even directed at you. YOU were the one who interjected and CONTINUED the poor analogy. So place the blame upon yourself. -
Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
What is free will.
What does omnipotent mean.
What does omnipresent mean.
We probably have different definitions which is leading to the confusion. -
Yes. It it WASNT free, it wouldnt be allowed to CHOOSE. Regardless of whether the company knows or not.
But if the company knows, then is the system truly free, or does it merely believe that it is free?
And if the company knows a product will be faulty before it produces it, then it is a shoddy manufacturer.
Lol this is a circular argument. Clearly the idea of 'freedom' is subject to interpretation.
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Either way donJaded Righteousness wrote: »
What is free will.
What does omnipotent mean.
What does omnipresent mean.
We probably have different definitions which is leading to the confusion.
Dont you think its weak for a ? to create a Devil and send people to hell for not believeing in him without showing yourself? -
BlackxChild wrote: »Either way donJaded Righteousness wrote: »
What is free will.
What does omnipotent mean.
What does omnipresent mean.
We probably have different definitions which is leading to the confusion.
Dont you think its weak for a ? to create a Devil and send people to hell for not believeing in him without showing yourself?
I believe it's questionable for him to want people to believe in him without verifiable proof yes. But I don't claim to understand it... -
BlackxChild wrote: »Either way donJaded Righteousness wrote: »
What is free will.
What does omnipotent mean.
What does omnipresent mean.
We probably have different definitions which is leading to the confusion.
Dont you think its weak for a ? to create a Devil and send people to hell for not believeing in him without showing yourself?
I believe it's questionable for him to want people to believe in him without verifiable proof yes. But I don't claim to understand it...
Do you think you could like an ? like that if you met him... He actually sounds like a bad guy. -
In the bible it's about "gods will", there's a "divine plan", and according to the bible "? is never changing", so prayer is pointless and so is anything you think or do beyond that.
Nothing you pray about can ever change it's "will", ever. So prayer makes no sense.
Free will ends up being trickery of the mind, if everything is according to gods plan and it is his will, nothing of your choice is free. It is gods will, not yours, even though you may feel or think that it is your choice.
9/11? Gods plan, this includes how it happened and all those who died and lived. This is his will. Sinking of the Titanic? Gods will.
So if everything is gods will and plan, our choices aren't ours and aren't our problems. ? has chose who would be "chosen ones" (for heaven) and he's chose who would be damned to hell. So sin doesn't really exist either, it's gods doing.
This means (towards ? ) love isn't real, hate isnt real etc.. It's ? playing a Sim game, he moves all the pieces as he pleases.
So what can be refuted? Nothing. This is from the bible, his divine word and plan. Nothing can ever deviate from it. -
Lol this is a circular argument. Clearly the idea of 'freedom' is subject to interpretation.
Forgive me for not seeing the circularity in my reasoning. It makes perfect sense to me. If someone knows precisely what you are going to do, then you aren't free in the truest sense of the word.
You're right, we would be better served to state the definitions we are using for these terms.
Omnipotent - all powerful; the ability to will any desire into being.
Omniscient - all knowing; knowledge of all things across time and space.
Free Will - the absolute, unhindered ability to choose your actions (I don't believe in this, by the way).
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u wish alot of people wish they was ? thats why they deny he's real. They wish they had the power to change the truth.
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Lol this is a circular argument. Clearly the idea of 'freedom' is subject to interpretation.
Forgive me for not seeing the circularity in my reasoning. It makes perfect sense to me. If someone knows precisely what you are going to do, then you aren't free in the truest sense of the word.
You're right, we would be better served to state the definitions we are using for these terms.
Omnipotent - all powerful; the ability to will any desire into being.
Omniscient - all knowing; knowledge of all things across time and space.
Free Will - the absolute, unhindered ability to choose your actions (I don't believe in this, by the way).
Ok I can agree to these terms.
So why cant one make an absolute unhindered decision even though an omniscient being knows what the decision will be. It's not as if the being is forcing you to make the decision. Your very own definition of omniscient doesn't include "hindering or controlling another being's actions", it's just knowing what the action will be.
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? doesn't create evil..
Isaiah 45:7 "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things."
If ? is the creator of everything, then he is the creator of evil
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? also isn't "all-powerful", if he is "never changing", then he cannot change anything therefore he has limits he's placed on himself.
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people are free to do whatever they want in this world,
just have to deal with the consequences of those actions if it goes against the laws of man or nature
