In about 50 years ? will be phased out.
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Comments
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Astronaut_King wrote: »Blah blah blah is how we answer the question. Of course. Lmao if everything you do from the time you are born will be moot why the ? do it? You can't take all the money you made, the love you have or the memories...so what us the point in living? Please answer this someone....
If ? has no beginning and/or end, why can't energy/the uni/metaverse? Answer that
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Faith. It will always be around.
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An Agnostic Theist? I don't run into you guys too often.
He is able and willing.
So then your question is where does evil come from?
In return, since answering questions with questions seems reasonable to you, I ask what is evil?
Before we begin, which ? are we discussing about? I'm assuming that it's some version of Yahweh, but I want to make sure that we're on the same page.
Right, the one in the Holy Bible, the one Christians believe in. Jehovah, Jesus etc... -
Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
This is an excellent article to read on that and it would say everything I would say:
http://carm.org/if-? -all-powerful-and-loving-why-there-suffering-world
A strong theme there is that ? gave us free will. And anything contrary to ? is evil. Therefore whenever we act against ? , we are committing evil. Therefore, that is where evil comes from. -
^ He really should just off himself so he can go to heaven since he believes theres a better life after this.
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BlackxChild wrote: »^ He really should just off himself so he can go to heaven since he believes theres a better life after this.
Idk if you are referring to me or the guy that wrote the article.
But if you are referring to anyone that believes In ? /Heaven/Hell/The Bible... that would be stupid. It states that suicide is a sin and sends you straight to hell.
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Heaven or hell is in your mind, when your life is fading away you will experience a "NDE" or "OBE", that's your last bit of mind working. Once all your organs stop working everything ceases to exist and you're no longer going to experience anything. Lights out.
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Right, the one in the Holy Bible, the one Christians believe in. Jehovah, Jesus etc...
Then I'll keep it simple and stick with two of the more important ten commandments, Yahweh frowns upon theft and murder. If that is the case, then why do theft and murder still happen? Theoretically, an omnipotent being would be able to end both effortlessly if he/she/it wanted to. Sure, you could bring up our supposed free will, but that directly conflicts with the idea of omniscience and omnipotence in a more roundabout way (not to mention Yahweh overrode the Pharaoh's free will when he felt like it). Frankly, Yahweh doesn't come off as triple omni in any of the religious texts he is featured in. Very powerful? Sure. Very Knowledgeable? Certainly. But neither attribute seemed absolute.
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I can't see ? ever phasing out.
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Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
This is an excellent article to read on that and it would say everything I would say:
http://carm.org/if-? -all-powerful-and-loving-why-there-suffering-world
A strong theme there is that ? gave us free will. And anything contrary to ? is evil. Therefore whenever we act against ? , we are committing evil. Therefore, that is where evil comes from.
In the Bible, ? says that he is the creator of evil. Therefore, it cannot be contrary to ? .
There is no free will. ? is omniscient and omnipresent. Even the wind moving a chime is ? 's doing. In other words, anything you can't do, it's because of ? . Therefore, you really have no free will. You do what ? allows you to do. And there are people who commit sins. ? allows them to do so. But ? is everywhere so it's really ? who is sinning and against himself and if ? is all powerful, allowing someone to sin is the same thing (to him) as committing the act himself
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Also, a glaring contradiction in the bible I always like to bring up is this: The bible says that love keeps no record of wrong doing. The Bible says that ? loves us. The Bible says that if we do wrong, ? keeps record of this, resulting in eternal punishment
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Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
This is an excellent article to read on that and it would say everything I would say:
http://carm.org/if-? -all-powerful-and-loving-why-there-suffering-world
A strong theme there is that ? gave us free will. And anything contrary to ? is evil. Therefore whenever we act against ? , we are committing evil. Therefore, that is where evil comes from.
In the Bible, ? says that he is the creator of evil. Therefore, it cannot be contrary to ? .
There is no free will. ? is omniscient and omnipresent. Even the wind moving a chime is ? 's doing. In other words, anything you can't do, it's because of ? . Therefore, you really have no free will. You do what ? allows you to do. And there are people who commit sins. ? allows them to do so. But ? is everywhere so it's really ? who is sinning and against himself and if ? is all powerful, allowing someone to sin is the same thing (to him) as committing the act himself
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Astronaut_King wrote: »So my man said there is no point in living, if this is what you believe. Thank you for answering the question @Doctopian. I don't knock people for not believing I just like to understand why. I don't think you are any less of a person or that im better than you. I just like discussion....with adults. The blah blah blahs are unnecessary and gets the conversation no where. So another question. Why live if there is no point?
the "blah blah blah" got you to say something other than the usual ? -
Astronaut_King wrote: »So my man said there is no point in living, if this is what you believe. Thank you for answering the question @Doctopian. I don't knock people for not believing I just like to understand why. I don't think you are any less of a person or that im better than you. I just like discussion....with adults. The blah blah blahs are unnecessary and gets the conversation no where. So another question. Why live if there is no point?
Like @Jaded Righteousness said, life is what you make it. Being the Existentialist that I am, I believe that everyone gives their own lives value and purpose; some are just more conscious of the process than others. Personally, I enjoy my life a little too much to end it prematurely.
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Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
This is an excellent article to read on that and it would say everything I would say:
http://carm.org/if-? -all-powerful-and-loving-why-there-suffering-world
A strong theme there is that ? gave us free will. And anything contrary to ? is evil. Therefore whenever we act against ? , we are committing evil. Therefore, that is where evil comes from.
Why isn't ? held accountable for the evil men that are born? He made the everything, did he not? That's like saying if company made a console that's faulty, that it's on the console not the company or the developer?
You can't surely agree with this.
He made everything, including creating free will. If he's omnipotent, he could've created us to be a slave army of robots, programmed to do his bidding. Free will is what lets us choose our actions, thoughts and beliefs. So basically, he's the company that makes the system, and the video game system is advanced enough to choose if it wants to be faulty or work perfectly. -
he's the company that makes the system, and the video game system is advanced enough to choose if it wants to be faulty or work perfectly.
the video game does exactly what the programmer wants it to do. If it doesn't it's the programmer's fault and most likely, he'll have a short career if he keeps it up
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Right, the one in the Holy Bible, the one Christians believe in. Jehovah, Jesus etc...
Then I'll keep it simple and stick with two of the more important ten commandments, Yahweh frowns upon theft and murder. If that is the case, then why do theft and murder still happen? Theoretically, an omnipotent being would be able to end both effortlessly if he/she/it wanted to. Sure, you could bring up our supposed free will, but that directly conflicts with the idea of omniscience and omnipotence in a more roundabout way (not to mention Yahweh overrode the Pharaoh's free will when he felt like it). Frankly, Yahweh doesn't come off as triple omni in any of the religious texts he is featured in. Very powerful? Sure. Very Knowledgeable? Certainly. But neither attribute seemed absolute.
Theft and murder happen because he gave humans the right to decide if they want to thieve and ? .
How is being able to create beings and give them their own ability to choose actions a conflict with the creator being all powerful.
You thinks he's less powerful because he gave us the ability to do what we want as opposed to controlling our every move? -
He made everything, including creating free will. If he's omnipotent, he could've created us to be a slave army of robots, programmed to do his bidding. Free will is what lets us choose our actions, thoughts and beliefs. So basically, he's the company that makes the system, and the video game system is advanced enough to choose if it wants to be faulty or work perfectly.
But if the company knows what the video game systems chooses before the system itself does, then is the system really free?
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Jaded Righteousness wrote: »Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
This is an excellent article to read on that and it would say everything I would say:
http://carm.org/if-? -all-powerful-and-loving-why-there-suffering-world
A strong theme there is that ? gave us free will. And anything contrary to ? is evil. Therefore whenever we act against ? , we are committing evil. Therefore, that is where evil comes from.
In the Bible, ? says that he is the creator of evil. Therefore, it cannot be contrary to ? .
There is no free will. ? is omniscient and omnipresent. Even the wind moving a chime is ? 's doing. In other words, anything you can't do, it's because of ? . Therefore, you really have no free will. You do what ? allows you to do. And there are people who commit sins. ? allows them to do so. But ? is everywhere so it's really ? who is sinning and against himself and if ? is all powerful, allowing someone to sin is the same thing (to him) as committing the act himself
? doesn't create evil.
http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/evil.html
And you cant say ? allows you do to w/e you want, and then say that there's no such thing as free will. Him allowing us to do what we want is the very definition of free will. -
Right, the one in the Holy Bible, the one Christians believe in. Jehovah, Jesus etc...
Then I'll keep it simple and stick with two of the more important ten commandments, Yahweh frowns upon theft and murder. If that is the case, then why do theft and murder still happen? Theoretically, an omnipotent being would be able to end both effortlessly if he/she/it wanted to. Sure, you could bring up our supposed free will, but that directly conflicts with the idea of omniscience and omnipotence in a more roundabout way (not to mention Yahweh overrode the Pharaoh's free will when he felt like it). Frankly, Yahweh doesn't come off as triple omni in any of the religious texts he is featured in. Very powerful? Sure. Very Knowledgeable? Certainly. But neither attribute seemed absolute.
Theft and murder happen because he gave humans the right to decide if they want to thieve and ? .
How is being able to create beings and give them their own ability to choose actions a conflict with the creator being all powerful.
You thinks he's less powerful because he gave us the ability to do what we want as opposed to controlling our every move?
but ? is omnipresent so what we do is his doing. We only do what he allows us to do. (to an omnipotent being) Allowing to do = Committing the act -
Jaded Righteousness wrote: »he's the company that makes the system, and the video game system is advanced enough to choose if it wants to be faulty or work perfectly.
the video game does exactly what the programmer wants it to do. If it doesn't it's the programmer's fault and most likely, he'll have a short career if he keeps it up
See, you are trying to compare something of extremely limited AI (such as video games) to something as complex as a human being.
Poor analogy. -
He made everything, including creating free will. If he's omnipotent, he could've created us to be a slave army of robots, programmed to do his bidding. Free will is what lets us choose our actions, thoughts and beliefs. So basically, he's the company that makes the system, and the video game system is advanced enough to choose if it wants to be faulty or work perfectly.
But if the company knows what the video game systems chooses before the system itself does, then is the system really free?
Yes. It it WASNT free, it wouldnt be allowed to CHOOSE. Regardless of whether the company knows or not. -
Jaded Righteousness wrote: »he's the company that makes the system, and the video game system is advanced enough to choose if it wants to be faulty or work perfectly.
the video game does exactly what the programmer wants it to do. If it doesn't it's the programmer's fault and most likely, he'll have a short career if he keeps it up
See, you are trying to compare something of extremely limited AI (such as video games) to something as complex as a human being.
Poor analogy.
It wasn't my analogy, smart guy. It was yours.
Both computers and humans (as you clearly show) have limited "intelligence"
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Jaded Righteousness wrote: »
Right, the one in the Holy Bible, the one Christians believe in. Jehovah, Jesus etc...
Then I'll keep it simple and stick with two of the more important ten commandments, Yahweh frowns upon theft and murder. If that is the case, then why do theft and murder still happen? Theoretically, an omnipotent being would be able to end both effortlessly if he/she/it wanted to. Sure, you could bring up our supposed free will, but that directly conflicts with the idea of omniscience and omnipotence in a more roundabout way (not to mention Yahweh overrode the Pharaoh's free will when he felt like it). Frankly, Yahweh doesn't come off as triple omni in any of the religious texts he is featured in. Very powerful? Sure. Very Knowledgeable? Certainly. But neither attribute seemed absolute.
Theft and murder happen because he gave humans the right to decide if they want to thieve and ? .
How is being able to create beings and give them their own ability to choose actions a conflict with the creator being all powerful.
You thinks he's less powerful because he gave us the ability to do what we want as opposed to controlling our every move?
but ? is omnipresent so what we do is his doing. We only do what he allows us to do. (to an omnipotent being) Allowing to do = Committing the act
But he allows us to do ANYTHING we want.
If you walk in my house and say can i ? your roommate, and I say yes, I won't stop you. And you do it. Am I charged for murder? No. Allowing =/= Committing the act. -
Jaded Righteousness wrote: »Jaded Righteousness wrote: »he's the company that makes the system, and the video game system is advanced enough to choose if it wants to be faulty or work perfectly.
the video game does exactly what the programmer wants it to do. If it doesn't it's the programmer's fault and most likely, he'll have a short career if he keeps it up
See, you are trying to compare something of extremely limited AI (such as video games) to something as complex as a human being.
Poor analogy.
It wasn't my analogy, smart guy. It was yours.
Both computers and humans (as you clearly show) have limited "intelligence"
No actually, someone else had originally brought up the video game analogy, I just continued along for his sake.
