"I Fear I May Have Integrated My People Into a Burning House" - Martin Luther King Jr.
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We would not be starting from zero at this point if blacks not not foolishly given up everything they had, blacks owned alot more of their own before integration black had ? to pass on. You belive this lie that black had nothing before integration, but the NOI alone had schools, stores and farms and they were not the only ones.
At least half the white population only got here around or after the time of the civil war. The irish and the italian alone make up at least close to a quater of the entire white population This is not to mention the swedish and norwegians. Only 9% of america is british-american and they are the people who founded this country
all these white nationalities see themselves as americans because they have adopted the culture that is being created in america, they are brought into the american way of life because they are white people.
What are you talking about? You're starting to make up ? again. The average black person did not have much prior to integration. And they certainly didn't give up stuff because of integration. You're making it seem like the black community was this prosperous entity that abandoned it in favor of integration. That's nonsense. The average black person in those days still worked service oriented jobs e.g., nannies, sharecropping, maids, etc... The people that did have their own small businesses didn't just give them up in favor of integration. A lot of those little businesses still exist. If small black businesses were sold or bought out for some reason, it has nothing to do with integration because integration has nothing to do with giving up your business.
And the Civil War was approaching 200 years ago, so I'm not sure what your point there is anymore. As I said, whites have had a long time to build up their wealth where as in a lot of that time, blacks were all but prevented from doing the same. -
The Lonious Monk wrote: »We would not be starting from zero at this point if blacks not not foolishly given up everything they had, blacks owned alot more of their own before integration black had ? to pass on. You belive this lie that black had nothing before integration, but the NOI alone had schools, stores and farms and they were not the only ones.
At least half the white population only got here around or after the time of the civil war. The irish and the italian alone make up at least close to a quater of the entire white population This is not to mention the swedish and norwegians. Only 9% of america is british-american and they are the people who founded this country
all these white nationalities see themselves as americans because they have adopted the culture that is being created in america, they are brought into the american way of life because they are white people.
What are you talking about? You're starting to make up ? again. The average black person did not have much prior to integration. And they certainly didn't give up stuff because of integration. You're making it seem like the black community was this prosperous entity that abandoned it in favor of integration. That's nonsense. The average black person in those days still worked service oriented jobs e.g., nannies, sharecropping, maids, etc... The people that did have their own small businesses didn't just give them up in favor of integration. A lot of those little businesses still exist. If small black businesses were sold or bought out for some reason, it has nothing to do with integration because integration has nothing to do with giving up your business.
And the Civil War was approaching 200 years ago, so I'm not sure what your point there is anymore. As I said, whites have had a long time to build up their wealth where as in a lot of that time, blacks were all but prevented from doing the same.
The average black person may not have had alot but as a community black people had more wealth, now we have less WEALTH and more money, blacks lost many of the black owned businesses after integration and i already told you how. A large percentage of white people are still relatively new their families have not had hundreds of years to build up anything.
200 years seems long but white people have been on this continent for since 1580's and started building there wealth then. If a white family only got here around 200 years ago then that if ? recent that is only a few generations. granted we were enslaved during much of america's history but after slavery blacks in america did manage to gain a certain level of wealth then came integration and ? said ? it and we stopped supporting our own. I am not saying this happened by conscious effort just that integration set up the situations to make this happen.
I have nothing up and i am not the only one who knows the damage integration has done to the black race in america. you are blind -
"Malcolm X Speaks" talks about when his trip to Africa and interaction with Whites
In his Autobiography he stated he rearranged how he felt about race
"A Life of Reinvention Malcolm X- Manning Marable also discuss how similar ideas
Your nationality can change you prospective just like it the person was white their perspective would be different. -
The Lonious Monk wrote: »We would not be starting from zero at this point if blacks not not foolishly given up everything they had, blacks owned alot more of their own before integration black had ? to pass on. You belive this lie that black had nothing before integration, but the NOI alone had schools, stores and farms and they were not the only ones.
At least half the white population only got here around or after the time of the civil war. The irish and the italian alone make up at least close to a quater of the entire white population This is not to mention the swedish and norwegians. Only 9% of america is british-american and they are the people who founded this country
all these white nationalities see themselves as americans because they have adopted the culture that is being created in america, they are brought into the american way of life because they are white people.
What are you talking about? You're starting to make up ? again. The average black person did not have much prior to integration. And they certainly didn't give up stuff because of integration. You're making it seem like the black community was this prosperous entity that abandoned it in favor of integration. That's nonsense. The average black person in those days still worked service oriented jobs e.g., nannies, sharecropping, maids, etc... The people that did have their own small businesses didn't just give them up in favor of integration. A lot of those little businesses still exist. If small black businesses were sold or bought out for some reason, it has nothing to do with integration because integration has nothing to do with giving up your business.
And the Civil War was approaching 200 years ago, so I'm not sure what your point there is anymore. As I said, whites have had a long time to build up their wealth where as in a lot of that time, blacks were all but prevented from doing the same.
The average black person may not have had alot but as a community black people had more wealth, now we have less WEALTH and more money, blacks lost many of the black owned businesses after integration and i already told you how. A large percentage of white people are still relatively new their families have not had hundreds of years to build up anything.
200 years seems long but white people have been on this continent for since 1580's and started building there wealth then. If a white family only got here around 200 years ago then that if ? recent that is only a few generations. granted we were enslaved during much of america's history but after slavery blacks in america did manage to gain a certain level of wealth then came integration and ? said ? it and we stopped supporting our own. I am not saying this happened by conscious effort just that integration set up the situations to make this happen.
I have nothing up and i am not the only one who knows the damage integration has done to the black race in america. you are blind
I think we're arguing two different points here. We both agree that the black community has been hurt because of a lack of unity and community building. Where we differ is that you believe that integration intrinsically leads to that, and integration is to blame for our woes. My stance is that integration is not to blame. It is something that was necessary in many ways. We are to blame because we dropped the ball. You can blame integration, but if people were so eager to turn tail, run, and do their own thing as soon as they got a little wealth, they would have done that with or without integration. The fault is always with the people because the people make the decisions. The same way jews, asians, and other communities make money off the greater american infrastructure and funnel it into their own communities, we could do that too. We just don't, and that's on us not integration. -
"Malcolm X Speaks" talks about when his trip to Africa and interaction with Whites
In his Autobiography he stated he rearranged how he felt about race
"A Life of Reinvention Malcolm X- Manning Marable also discuss how similar ideas
Your nationality can change you prospective just like it the person was white their perspective would be different.
Malcom x rearranging his thoughts i admitted too but he neverarranged them toward social integration WHICH IS MY POINT. Manning marable is the same man who claimed malcom x had a homosexual relationship with a white man. GTFOH you better get a better source about mal x. Nationality cannot change what is documented. -
The Lonious Monk wrote: »The Lonious Monk wrote: »We would not be starting from zero at this point if blacks not not foolishly given up everything they had, blacks owned alot more of their own before integration black had ? to pass on. You belive this lie that black had nothing before integration, but the NOI alone had schools, stores and farms and they were not the only ones.
At least half the white population only got here around or after the time of the civil war. The irish and the italian alone make up at least close to a quater of the entire white population This is not to mention the swedish and norwegians. Only 9% of america is british-american and they are the people who founded this country
all these white nationalities see themselves as americans because they have adopted the culture that is being created in america, they are brought into the american way of life because they are white people.
What are you talking about? You're starting to make up ? again. The average black person did not have much prior to integration. And they certainly didn't give up stuff because of integration. You're making it seem like the black community was this prosperous entity that abandoned it in favor of integration. That's nonsense. The average black person in those days still worked service oriented jobs e.g., nannies, sharecropping, maids, etc... The people that did have their own small businesses didn't just give them up in favor of integration. A lot of those little businesses still exist. If small black businesses were sold or bought out for some reason, it has nothing to do with integration because integration has nothing to do with giving up your business.
And the Civil War was approaching 200 years ago, so I'm not sure what your point there is anymore. As I said, whites have had a long time to build up their wealth where as in a lot of that time, blacks were all but prevented from doing the same.
The average black person may not have had alot but as a community black people had more wealth, now we have less WEALTH and more money, blacks lost many of the black owned businesses after integration and i already told you how. A large percentage of white people are still relatively new their families have not had hundreds of years to build up anything.
200 years seems long but white people have been on this continent for since 1580's and started building there wealth then. If a white family only got here around 200 years ago then that if ? recent that is only a few generations. granted we were enslaved during much of america's history but after slavery blacks in america did manage to gain a certain level of wealth then came integration and ? said ? it and we stopped supporting our own. I am not saying this happened by conscious effort just that integration set up the situations to make this happen.
I have nothing up and i am not the only one who knows the damage integration has done to the black race in america. you are blind
I think we're arguing two different points here. We both agree that the black community has been hurt because of a lack of unity and community building. Where we differ is that you believe that integration intrinsically leads to that, and integration is to blame for our woes. My stance is that integration is not to blame. It is something that was necessary in many ways. We are to blame because we dropped the ball. You can blame integration, but if people were so eager to turn tail, run, and do their own thing as soon as they got a little wealth, they would have done that with or without integration. The fault is always with the people because the people make the decisions. The same way jews, asians, and other communities make money off the greater american infrastructure and funnel it into their own communities, we could do that too. We just don't, and that's on us not integration.
I now understand your opinion i somewhat agree but i also disagree. ultimately it is our fault because we allowed it to happen but people follow their belly before their heads and i think that's what happened in america. before integration rich black had no place to go they had to stay in the black community. jews and asians have stronger cultural bonds to each other so it was harder for to be broken up. In our community it was easier to economically divide and conquer. and that is all i have to say on the subject. -
I now understand your opinion i somewhat agree but i also disagree. ultimately it is our fault because we allowed it to happen but people follow their belly before their heads and i think that's what happened in america. before integration rich black had no place to go they had to stay in the black community. jews and asians have stronger cultural bonds to each other so it was harder for to be broken up. In our community it was easier to economically divide and conquer. and that is all i have to say on the subject.
Yeah, I agree with all of that. That's why it was unfortunate that leaders like MLK and Malcolm were killed off when and the way they were. Especially given the subject of the thread. I think had MLK lived, after integration, he probably would have switched gears to focus more on career building and the people would have followed him. -
I gave a few sources that gave similar information. Dude could have been a closet case you don't know that either but from you previous post about ? I understand your discontent. Personally I don't care. MLKj was a preacher banging random chicks. I take is as a possibility of something that could have happened but no one else put it together so idk.
Facts are universal until they are not. You read and see one thing I see another -
I gave a few sources that gave similar information. Dude could have been a closet case you don't know that either but from you previous post about ? I understand your discontent. Personally I don't care. MLKj was a preacher banging random chicks. I take is as a possibility of something that could have happened but no one else put it together so idk.
Facts are universal until they are not. You read and see one thing I see another
the difference is the fbi had real documented proof that mlk was ? white women and there is no proof that mal x was a ? and their is no proof that he wanted social integration either. facts are not a matter of opinion and your sources are ? .
http://www.npr.org/2011/04/20/135570322/malcolm-xs-daughter-addresses-controversial-claims-in-new-bio-on-father -
I don't think she was there either. I never said the ? ? was a fact but he did go away from the other stuff. Neither of us have sufficient evidence to convince or disprove each other so we can stop running in this circle but I enjoyed the conversation.
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I don't think she was there either. I never said the ? ? was a fact but he did go away from the other stuff. Neither of us have sufficient evidence to convince or disprove each other so we can stop running in this circle but I enjoyed the conversation.
the video i dropped is enough proof and you don't have a better source and like his daughter said the autobio is faulty and is not the book that mal x wanted published, his family has the original manuscript and the other book is pure ? . You don't want to admit you are wrong which is the sign of a defeated person. he moved away from other stuff but never moved toward integration. Get that through you head and stop spreading lies. -
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if it has nothing to do with the argument, why are you asking me as part of your argument? could it be that you're simply lying on this point?Can you answer the ? question what race do you identify as ? me asking you what race you are has nothing to do with the argument-
literally posted them two posts prior. AGAIN. but it's not like you're going to suddenly read them if it comes up a third time, right?what are you observation about mal x?
what part of "he got ? shot so obviously we can't know where things were headed with 100% certainty" is that challenging to understand?where is the real proof observations are too subjective
but it had nothing to do with the argument, right?You know what @JANKLOW ? it don't answer my post you are white and therefore you thoughts on mal x don't interest me for that matter nor do your thoughts on anything
see, that's why i won't answer the question. but now you're outed yourself as a combination of a liar and a ? poster. well done!
remember, guys, an exhaustively researched and well-sourced book can be dismissed because it hurt zombie's feelingsManning marable is the same man who claimed malcom x had a homosexual relationship with a white man. GTFOH you better get a better source about mal x. Nationality cannot change what is documented. -
http://www.mywalkwithfarrakhan.com/2010/11/gaining-complete-view-of-martin-luther.html
Elijah Muhammad recounting his meeting with Martin Luther King said the following:
"When Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. talked with me at my home, I saw in him that he wanted to believe me; but, he was so afraid of his enemies. Self first, you cannot serve two masters. I tried my best to put fearlessness in him. Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. admitted to me that I am teaching right. He admitted that the white man is the devil, but he was afraid to take a stand and preach that the white man is the devil... If Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. had lasted to this day he would have been in the same corner with me. The devil had Rev. Martin Luther King,Jr. in his power through fear. But good hearted Black Brother, Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. had a good heart"
Why would someone fight for something they don't believe in?
Why would someone fight for something they believe will be detrimental/destructive for those they are supposedly fighting for?
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NeighborhoodNomad. wrote: »http://www.mywalkwithfarrakhan.com/2010/11/gaining-complete-view-of-martin-luther.html
Elijah Muhammad recounting his meeting with Martin Luther King said the following:
"When Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. talked with me at my home, I saw in him that he wanted to believe me; but, he was so afraid of his enemies. Self first, you cannot serve two masters. I tried my best to put fearlessness in him. Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. admitted to me that I am teaching right. He admitted that the white man is the devil, but he was afraid to take a stand and preach that the white man is the devil... If Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. had lasted to this day he would have been in the same corner with me. The devil had Rev. Martin Luther King,Jr. in his power through fear. But good hearted Black Brother, Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. had a good heart"
Why would someone fight for something they don't believe in?
Why would someone fight for something they believe will be detrimental/destructive for those they are supposedly fighting for?
Good point -
Not a major dis but he is a known lair. He manipulated many situations to help himself even if it harmed his cause. i'm happy for the people he helped but I don't believe anything he says.NeighborhoodNomad. wrote: »http://www.mywalkwithfarrakhan.com/2010/11/gaining-complete-view-of-martin-luther.html
Elijah Muhammad recounting his meeting with Martin Luther King said the following:
"When Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. talked with me at my home, I saw in him that he wanted to believe me; but, he was so afraid of his enemies. Self first, you cannot serve two masters. I tried my best to put fearlessness in him. Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. admitted to me that I am teaching right. He admitted that the white man is the devil, but he was afraid to take a stand and preach that the white man is the devil... If Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. had lasted to this day he would have been in the same corner with me. The devil had Rev. Martin Luther King,Jr. in his power through fear. But good hearted Black Brother, Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. had a good heart"
Why would someone fight for something they don't believe in?
Why would someone fight for something they believe will be detrimental/destructive for those they are supposedly fighting for? -
Integration was allowed to happen because it served the economic and political interest of rich white people which is the same reason why feminism was allowed to happen.
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this thread=misinformation
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Integration was allowed to happen because it served the economic and political interest of rich white people which is the same reason why feminism was allowed to happen.
This is probably true, but it should also be pointed out that slavery and segregation were instituted for the same reasons.
That's why poor white people are without a doubt the dumbest people in the world. They hate minorities and have no idea that it's the rich members of their own race that do them the worst.
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Integration was the worst thing that happened to the Black race in amerikkka. When we our ancestors were marching for civil rights we should have been marching for sovereignty. Our ancestors had all of the skill sets to make it on our own. We should have been taking our skills and migrating to other countries with other AfriKans and giving to them tools to succeed. Building economic systems in other areas in the world. Imagine hundreds of thousands of black wall streets in AfriKa, the carribean, brazil etc. But we let something as trivial as different bathrooms and water fountains and sitting on the back of the bus become the black agenda. The amerikkka south would a the equivalent to a 3rd world country right now if it wasn't for the Black man's hands. Blacks need to come to the realization that no matter what we achieve, how much money we make, in this system of racism-white supremacy, they will never accept us as equals.And we shouldn't strive to be their equals, we have to rise above the beast that is the white man.
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this was a great thread damn the site needs more threads like this...
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kingblaze84 wrote: »A great article I read online on the destructive effect integration has had on Blacks........here are just some snippets of it....integration has done more harm then good for Blacks.....
http://www.thinkaboutit-knowaboutit.com/2013/06/did-integration-hurt-black-america.html
Though the Civil Rights Act officially ended legal discrimination, black people continued to face inequality and they were still oppressed. Worse, the black community was fracturing as it rapidly changed from a tight-knit and self-sustaining community to a community that was increasingly coming to rely on white grace. Middle-class black business owners established their own communities, leaving their lower-class brothers and sisters behind. To this day, middle class black Americans and poor black Americans remain separated from each other.
Look at the current state of black America. It is no longer unified as it was under segregation. This is because segregation forced blacks to sink or swim, and they swam by establishing their own self-sustained community.
After segregation ended, black restaurants, theaters, insurance companies, banks, etc. disappeared, and hard economic times destroyed black neighborhoods that had previously flourished. An economic vacuum ensued and jobs were scarce. Coupled with the power vacuum that occurred when black civil rights leaders were killed and subsequent black power movements were destroyed, black America found itself in the midst of a lack of leadership, drugs, gang violence, extreme poverty, and desperation.
But hey, at least America was integrated.
Today, black people spend 95% of their money at white businesses. Black businesses are owned by white enterprises. Though there are some cities that contain black businesses and institutions (most notably Atlanta), millions of black people are still suffering under the conditions that led to the deterioration of black America.
Integration seemed promising, and it did indeed afford blacks many basic human rights. But integration was a promise that failed. It failed to end racism, it failed to end discrimination, and it failed to uplift the black community as a whole. And to this day, blacks and whites still segregate themselves from each other anyway.
So forced segregation against your own will is the solution? It must come out of understanding and love out of your own people. Let black folk make their own choice, especially in the globalized 21st century.
they could have reformed the system not integrate the system, was forced integration the answer to the racial problems in america? i think not. It made the usa a friendlier place to live for black people but in the process blacks lost the only thing that counts in this society economic power aka freedom. Now we have more opportunity but we end up working for other people. Black people have been mis- educated and under-edcuated and therefore do not make good economic choices. That fact is clear and obvious when you look at the numbers. African americans SPENDING POWER will reach 1.1 trillion dollars by 2015 yet blacks are still poor had they reformed segregation then at least half of that money could have been poured into the black community.
In that theory, black folk would have thrived in segregation times. Not just Black Wall Street Tulsa, but all over. I Was saying that the freedom of CHOICE was what people wanted. Some places still remained segregated throughout the 70s-90s, too. Sometimes, you ahve to force progression on a social standard, cause all the other countries were passing us at that time period in race equality.
Did you know that the Jim Crow Laws gave birth to ? regime in Europe? Yeah, that segregation ? planted the seeds that nearly wiped out mankind. ? learned from Jim Crow and he nearly did it. -
What you don't understand is there is no such thing as seperate but equal. Black people had second class education, healthcare, and housing. In a lot of places they couldn't even see the doctor or dentist they had to go to the vet. So this fairytale of blacks having it so good before intergration is wrong.
SMH at yall still falling for the Martin vs. Malcolm okeydoke, yall negroes are well trained. -
Maybe he was lamenting the fact that we put too much emphasis on "acceptance" and not enough on equality. And I don't think he was talking about putting out the fire on "? 's house" as much as he was fearing us entering that burning house in the first place.
