Why do people call the devil a "thief, liar, and murderer"?
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kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »@kingblaze84 In regards to Numbers 21:5 and 6...there is a context to all of this. Way before this "complaint", ? gave Israel over to the Egyptians and were enslaved for quite a time. ? promised Israel that He will deliver them through Moses and did so in "miraculous" fashion. And this is a prime example of not believing in spite of the evidence. If ? parted the Red Sea before the eyes of the Israelites, that should have been enough to make ? their Lord. But, when times got rough out there in the desert, they forget that ? had done anything and want to go back to Egypt. They no longer believe in ? when He stopped working His Magic.
Yeah, I always found it interesting how the Israelites' faith would waver when their ? stopped working magic.
I suppose it's because it could have been any number of gods who could have worked those miracles, assuming those miracles happened to begin with. Many of the Israelites, rationally, could have believed those "miracles" were just random coincidences.
There's a reason Jews have one of the highest rates of atheism in the world, look at the Holocaust. The Bible ? didn't save any Jews when ? and his Nazis were killing them all over the place. Where was the Bible ? 's magic then lol
The Israelites were not displaying faith. They wanted to use ? for their own self interest...just like anyone else would if given the chance. When they saw they was not getting what they wanted from ? , they complained. They didn't care whether or not their deliverance from Egypt into the Promised Land served a higher purpose. They didn't care if it meant robbing Moses of the privilege of entering the land with them given ? used Him to get them there. Why be delivered from our circumstances when we are still in our sins?
That's the funny thing though, the Bible ? knows people are going to be skeptical. If people are going through hardships and they taste bread that tastes horrible and they're still hungry in the desert, shouldn't the Bible ? understand why people were complaining?
Of course some of the other Israelites were gonna worship other gods, they saw how other people in foreign lands were worshipping other gods and seemed to be blessed with tons of food and housing. Unlike the Israelites who kept having bad luck and were not having anything to themselves. The Abrahamic ? couldn't see that coming? So to make sure the jealousy of his ended, he told his followers to ? and massacre the ones who were complaining. Yeah that's a very nice thing to do.
Instead of proving himself and maybe blessing his people more, it said, "Ima ? ya'll, even your kids, if you keep complaining about me". Is this the behavior of a rational and supposedly all loving being? Hell no, instead of addressing their concerns better and rationally, it chose to act like Ted Bundy on steroids. How the hell is it gonna complain about people sinning then.
This issue isn't about what ? already knows. It's about man making a choice to chose ? based on what has already been said. Israel knew of the promise to them, yet they behaved as people who never heard it; that ? had done nothing to make good on His Promise.
You have come to your own conclusions about ? by the will to chose. Would it be right for ? to let you choose who you don't like? Would it be fair for ? to force Himself on you given what you believe about Him? You wouldn't enjoy Heaven if ? let you in because you would still be suspicious of Him. -
@kingblaze84
? is working on his own time and the issues you seem to have with this is that you want ? to do what you want him too when you want him to do it. you are like a crying 10 year old, you stamp your feet and walk away when daddy or mommy says no or they do something you don't like . Your slander of ? is sad and pathetic your intellectual analysis of the bible is child like and simple minded.
You also don't know much about the bible because the oppression of the church is part of the deal it's been promised to all christians that we could face death. Death, especially beheading is promised to us. No, ? just does not answer your prayers and give you what you want just because you asked for it, it does not work like that. ? did not make adam and eve imperfect because you cannot create a sentient creature without giving them the ability to do wrong.
Okay if you truly believe this stuff good for you, but the Bible ? 's behavior still makes me laugh. I don't know how your mind does these gymnastics to support the Bible ? 's behavior and its funny ways of letting its followers suffer all the time (on purpose smh) while lying about helping if praying occurs.
I don't know how you do it, but it's very funny to me. -
alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »@kingblaze84 In regards to Numbers 21:5 and 6...there is a context to all of this. Way before this "complaint", ? gave Israel over to the Egyptians and were enslaved for quite a time. ? promised Israel that He will deliver them through Moses and did so in "miraculous" fashion. And this is a prime example of not believing in spite of the evidence. If ? parted the Red Sea before the eyes of the Israelites, that should have been enough to make ? their Lord. But, when times got rough out there in the desert, they forget that ? had done anything and want to go back to Egypt. They no longer believe in ? when He stopped working His Magic.
Yeah, I always found it interesting how the Israelites' faith would waver when their ? stopped working magic.
I suppose it's because it could have been any number of gods who could have worked those miracles, assuming those miracles happened to begin with. Many of the Israelites, rationally, could have believed those "miracles" were just random coincidences.
There's a reason Jews have one of the highest rates of atheism in the world, look at the Holocaust. The Bible ? didn't save any Jews when ? and his Nazis were killing them all over the place. Where was the Bible ? 's magic then lol
The Israelites were not displaying faith. They wanted to use ? for their own self interest...just like anyone else would if given the chance. When they saw they was not getting what they wanted from ? , they complained. They didn't care whether or not their deliverance from Egypt into the Promised Land served a higher purpose. They didn't care if it meant robbing Moses of the privilege of entering the land with them given ? used Him to get them there. Why be delivered from our circumstances when we are still in our sins?
That's the funny thing though, the Bible ? knows people are going to be skeptical. If people are going through hardships and they taste bread that tastes horrible and they're still hungry in the desert, shouldn't the Bible ? understand why people were complaining?
Of course some of the other Israelites were gonna worship other gods, they saw how other people in foreign lands were worshipping other gods and seemed to be blessed with tons of food and housing. Unlike the Israelites who kept having bad luck and were not having anything to themselves. The Abrahamic ? couldn't see that coming? So to make sure the jealousy of his ended, he told his followers to ? and massacre the ones who were complaining. Yeah that's a very nice thing to do.
Instead of proving himself and maybe blessing his people more, it said, "Ima ? ya'll, even your kids, if you keep complaining about me". Is this the behavior of a rational and supposedly all loving being? Hell no, instead of addressing their concerns better and rationally, it chose to act like Ted Bundy on steroids. How the hell is it gonna complain about people sinning then.
This issue isn't about what ? already knows. It's about man making a choice to chose ? based on what has already been said. Israel knew of the promise to them, yet they behaved as people who never heard it; that ? had done nothing to make good on His Promise.
You have come to your own conclusions about ? by the will to chose. Would it be right for ? to let you choose who you don't like? Would it be fair for ? to force Himself on you given what you believe about Him? You wouldn't enjoy Heaven if ? let you in because you would still be suspicious of Him.
That's fair and all but what's a little weird is how this ? of yours keeps breaking its promises, especially the New Testament version. So why would people keep trusting a being that keeps lying? The thread title is about lies.....Jesus said he would come quickly four times at least and 2,000 years later no one sees this guy. He also said prayers would work under his name, and always be answered but uhhh........that's not the case in Libya or parts of Nigeria. All those Christian girls kidnapped by Boko Haram didn't see any ? protecting them, despite the thousands of prayers on Twitter and Youtube.
So yeah, you can say I'd be suspicious of him lol. It would be rational to do so. Remember the Bible ? saying it would bring its people peace and yet Jews have yet to see any real peace in Israel?
Would you trust someone who lies to you over and over again? -
kingblaze84 wrote: »@kingblaze84
? is working on his own time and the issues you seem to have with this is that you want ? to do what you want him too when you want him to do it. you are like a crying 10 year old, you stamp your feet and walk away when daddy or mommy says no or they do something you don't like . Your slander of ? is sad and pathetic your intellectual analysis of the bible is child like and simple minded.
You also don't know much about the bible because the oppression of the church is part of the deal it's been promised to all christians that we could face death. Death, especially beheading is promised to us. No, ? just does not answer your prayers and give you what you want just because you asked for it, it does not work like that. ? did not make adam and eve imperfect because you cannot create a sentient creature without giving them the ability to do wrong.
Okay if you truly believe this stuff good for you, but the Bible ? 's behavior still makes me laugh. I don't know how your mind does these gymnastics to support the Bible ? 's behavior and its funny ways of letting its followers suffer all the time (on purpose smh) while lying about helping if praying occurs.
I don't know how you do it, but it's very funny to me.
YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND AND THAT'S REALLY VERY SAD TO ME
YOU HAVE TO PRAY ACCORDING TO THE WILL OF ? and prayer is not about trying to change the mind of ? so that he does what you wants. Prayer is about asking ? to do his will which we should want if we believe and trust him.
In other words, when we make ? 's will to be our will, our will will be done because it is his will, and his will is done always. If we can understand this truth, we can avoid much confusion and begin to pray right. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »@kingblaze84 In regards to Numbers 21:5 and 6...there is a context to all of this. Way before this "complaint", ? gave Israel over to the Egyptians and were enslaved for quite a time. ? promised Israel that He will deliver them through Moses and did so in "miraculous" fashion. And this is a prime example of not believing in spite of the evidence. If ? parted the Red Sea before the eyes of the Israelites, that should have been enough to make ? their Lord. But, when times got rough out there in the desert, they forget that ? had done anything and want to go back to Egypt. They no longer believe in ? when He stopped working His Magic.
Yeah, I always found it interesting how the Israelites' faith would waver when their ? stopped working magic.
I suppose it's because it could have been any number of gods who could have worked those miracles, assuming those miracles happened to begin with. Many of the Israelites, rationally, could have believed those "miracles" were just random coincidences.
There's a reason Jews have one of the highest rates of atheism in the world, look at the Holocaust. The Bible ? didn't save any Jews when ? and his Nazis were killing them all over the place. Where was the Bible ? 's magic then lol
The Israelites were not displaying faith. They wanted to use ? for their own self interest...just like anyone else would if given the chance. When they saw they was not getting what they wanted from ? , they complained. They didn't care whether or not their deliverance from Egypt into the Promised Land served a higher purpose. They didn't care if it meant robbing Moses of the privilege of entering the land with them given ? used Him to get them there. Why be delivered from our circumstances when we are still in our sins?
That's the funny thing though, the Bible ? knows people are going to be skeptical. If people are going through hardships and they taste bread that tastes horrible and they're still hungry in the desert, shouldn't the Bible ? understand why people were complaining?
Of course some of the other Israelites were gonna worship other gods, they saw how other people in foreign lands were worshipping other gods and seemed to be blessed with tons of food and housing. Unlike the Israelites who kept having bad luck and were not having anything to themselves. The Abrahamic ? couldn't see that coming? So to make sure the jealousy of his ended, he told his followers to ? and massacre the ones who were complaining. Yeah that's a very nice thing to do.
Instead of proving himself and maybe blessing his people more, it said, "Ima ? ya'll, even your kids, if you keep complaining about me". Is this the behavior of a rational and supposedly all loving being? Hell no, instead of addressing their concerns better and rationally, it chose to act like Ted Bundy on steroids. How the hell is it gonna complain about people sinning then.
This issue isn't about what ? already knows. It's about man making a choice to chose ? based on what has already been said. Israel knew of the promise to them, yet they behaved as people who never heard it; that ? had done nothing to make good on His Promise.
You have come to your own conclusions about ? by the will to chose. Would it be right for ? to let you choose who you don't like? Would it be fair for ? to force Himself on you given what you believe about Him? You wouldn't enjoy Heaven if ? let you in because you would still be suspicious of Him.
That's fair and all but what's a little weird is how this ? of yours keeps breaking its promises, especially the New Testament version. So why would people keep trusting a being that keeps lying? The thread title is about lies.....Jesus said he would come quickly four times at least and 2,000 years later no one sees this guy. He also said prayers would work under his name, and always be answered but uhhh........that's not the case in Libya or parts of Nigeria. All those Christian girls kidnapped by Boko Haram didn't see any ? protecting them, despite the thousands of prayers on Twitter and Youtube.
So yeah, you can say I'd be suspicious of him lol. It would be rational to do so. Remember the Bible ? saying it would bring its people peace and yet Jews have yet to see any real peace in Israel?
Would you trust someone who lies to you over and over again?
? hasn't broken His Promise to man. But man has. The Bible pretty much tells the story of how man tries...and fails to keep our end of the bargain with ? and really being clueless to what that promise is. Along with the Jews, Jesus's disciples didn't have a clue the whole time they were with him. It was only after Jesus died and rose again that the light bulb came on.
The promise is that He saves us from sin through His Son Jesus. In our sin, we would have to pay for it with our souls and it is a debt we can never paid back. It is in this promise that people can find peace.
However, you seem to think that ? 's Promise is to deliver us from the bad circumstances of our lives. It's fine if He does, but that is not what it's about. What good is ? giving the material things of this world if it does nothing for the soul? -
This is why salvation is such an idiotic concept.
G-d puts man in a position to fail, knowing they would surely fail, punishes them for failing, makes an elaborate plan to save SOME of them, and expects GRATITUDE for it?
? that. If the police planted coke on you then locked you up on drug charges, only to let you go months later, would you be greatful to them? If they claimed to have done it for your good, would you love them for granting you the experience? If you had a lawyer that was willing to fight the charges on your behalf, would you blame them for your predicament? -
soul rattler wrote: »This is why salvation is such an idiotic concept.
G-d puts man in a position to fail, knowing they would surely fail, punishes them for failing, makes an elaborate plan to save SOME of them, and expects GRATITUDE for it?
? that. If the police planted coke on you then locked you up on drug charges, only to let you go months later, would you be greatful to them? If they claimed to have done it for your good, would you love them for granting you the experience? If you had a lawyer that was willing to fight the charges on your behalf, would you blame them for your predicament?
I think the police example is a bad one. Cops planting drugs on somebody means the accused didn't have a choice in the matter. The cop's intentions were to find someone guilty whether they were guilty of something or not. I doubt cops bust people to teach them some valuable life lesson. That just goes against how justice system is suppose to work. Now if I was falsely accused, I would feel some type of way about it, but my hope is that I can step back and see that it is in our sinful nature to lie on each other.
Being in a position to fail is totally different than failing. Jesus was in a desert yet he chose ? . You still have a choice to either do what's right or wrong. -
alissowack wrote: »soul rattler wrote: »This is why salvation is such an idiotic concept.
G-d puts man in a position to fail, knowing they would surely fail, punishes them for failing, makes an elaborate plan to save SOME of them, and expects GRATITUDE for it?
? that. If the police planted coke on you then locked you up on drug charges, only to let you go months later, would you be greatful to them? If they claimed to have done it for your good, would you love them for granting you the experience? If you had a lawyer that was willing to fight the charges on your behalf, would you blame them for your predicament?
I think the police example is a bad one. Cops planting drugs on somebody means the accused didn't have a choice in the matter. The cop's intentions were to find someone guilty whether they were guilty of something or not. I doubt cops bust people to teach them some valuable life lesson. That just goes against how justice system is suppose to work. Now if I was falsely accused, I would feel some type of way about it, but my hope is that I can step back and see that it is in our sinful nature to lie on each other.
Being in a position to fail is totally different than failing. Jesus was in a desert yet he chose ? . You still have a choice to either do what's right or wrong.
I was referring to humanity and the fall of man. Adam and Eve didn't choose to be created, nor could they have understood the gravity of punishment that resulted from eating from the tree. In that regard, their hands we're tied. -
soul rattler wrote: »alissowack wrote: »soul rattler wrote: »This is why salvation is such an idiotic concept.
G-d puts man in a position to fail, knowing they would surely fail, punishes them for failing, makes an elaborate plan to save SOME of them, and expects GRATITUDE for it?
? that. If the police planted coke on you then locked you up on drug charges, only to let you go months later, would you be greatful to them? If they claimed to have done it for your good, would you love them for granting you the experience? If you had a lawyer that was willing to fight the charges on your behalf, would you blame them for your predicament?
I think the police example is a bad one. Cops planting drugs on somebody means the accused didn't have a choice in the matter. The cop's intentions were to find someone guilty whether they were guilty of something or not. I doubt cops bust people to teach them some valuable life lesson. That just goes against how justice system is suppose to work. Now if I was falsely accused, I would feel some type of way about it, but my hope is that I can step back and see that it is in our sinful nature to lie on each other.
Being in a position to fail is totally different than failing. Jesus was in a desert yet he chose ? . You still have a choice to either do what's right or wrong.
I was referring to humanity and the fall of man. Adam and Eve didn't choose to be created, nor could they have understood the gravity of punishment that resulted from eating from the tree. In that regard, their hands we're tied.
Their hands were not tied. Adam and Eve didn't need to know the gravity of the consequence. They just need to trust ? with the things He said to do or not do. However, they placed their trust in what the serpent had to say. -
alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »@kingblaze84 In regards to Numbers 21:5 and 6...there is a context to all of this. Way before this "complaint", ? gave Israel over to the Egyptians and were enslaved for quite a time. ? promised Israel that He will deliver them through Moses and did so in "miraculous" fashion. And this is a prime example of not believing in spite of the evidence. If ? parted the Red Sea before the eyes of the Israelites, that should have been enough to make ? their Lord. But, when times got rough out there in the desert, they forget that ? had done anything and want to go back to Egypt. They no longer believe in ? when He stopped working His Magic.
Yeah, I always found it interesting how the Israelites' faith would waver when their ? stopped working magic.
I suppose it's because it could have been any number of gods who could have worked those miracles, assuming those miracles happened to begin with. Many of the Israelites, rationally, could have believed those "miracles" were just random coincidences.
There's a reason Jews have one of the highest rates of atheism in the world, look at the Holocaust. The Bible ? didn't save any Jews when ? and his Nazis were killing them all over the place. Where was the Bible ? 's magic then lol
The Israelites were not displaying faith. They wanted to use ? for their own self interest...just like anyone else would if given the chance. When they saw they was not getting what they wanted from ? , they complained. They didn't care whether or not their deliverance from Egypt into the Promised Land served a higher purpose. They didn't care if it meant robbing Moses of the privilege of entering the land with them given ? used Him to get them there. Why be delivered from our circumstances when we are still in our sins?
That's the funny thing though, the Bible ? knows people are going to be skeptical. If people are going through hardships and they taste bread that tastes horrible and they're still hungry in the desert, shouldn't the Bible ? understand why people were complaining?
Of course some of the other Israelites were gonna worship other gods, they saw how other people in foreign lands were worshipping other gods and seemed to be blessed with tons of food and housing. Unlike the Israelites who kept having bad luck and were not having anything to themselves. The Abrahamic ? couldn't see that coming? So to make sure the jealousy of his ended, he told his followers to ? and massacre the ones who were complaining. Yeah that's a very nice thing to do.
Instead of proving himself and maybe blessing his people more, it said, "Ima ? ya'll, even your kids, if you keep complaining about me". Is this the behavior of a rational and supposedly all loving being? Hell no, instead of addressing their concerns better and rationally, it chose to act like Ted Bundy on steroids. How the hell is it gonna complain about people sinning then.
This issue isn't about what ? already knows. It's about man making a choice to chose ? based on what has already been said. Israel knew of the promise to them, yet they behaved as people who never heard it; that ? had done nothing to make good on His Promise.
You have come to your own conclusions about ? by the will to chose. Would it be right for ? to let you choose who you don't like? Would it be fair for ? to force Himself on you given what you believe about Him? You wouldn't enjoy Heaven if ? let you in because you would still be suspicious of Him.
That's fair and all but what's a little weird is how this ? of yours keeps breaking its promises, especially the New Testament version. So why would people keep trusting a being that keeps lying? The thread title is about lies.....Jesus said he would come quickly four times at least and 2,000 years later no one sees this guy. He also said prayers would work under his name, and always be answered but uhhh........that's not the case in Libya or parts of Nigeria. All those Christian girls kidnapped by Boko Haram didn't see any ? protecting them, despite the thousands of prayers on Twitter and Youtube.
So yeah, you can say I'd be suspicious of him lol. It would be rational to do so. Remember the Bible ? saying it would bring its people peace and yet Jews have yet to see any real peace in Israel?
Would you trust someone who lies to you over and over again?
? hasn't broken His Promise to man. But man has. The Bible pretty much tells the story of how man tries...and fails to keep our end of the bargain with ? and really being clueless to what that promise is. Along with the Jews, Jesus's disciples didn't have a clue the whole time they were with him. It was only after Jesus died and rose again that the light bulb came on.
The promise is that He saves us from sin through His Son Jesus. In our sin, we would have to pay for it with our souls and it is a debt we can never paid back. It is in this promise that people can find peace.
However, you seem to think that ? 's Promise is to deliver us from the bad circumstances of our lives. It's fine if He does, but that is not what it's about. What good is ? giving the material things of this world if it does nothing for the soul?
Well there isn't enough evidence of this ? of yours being alive anymore. Where is it? Why is it so powerless in saving its own followers, especially the Jews? Jesus said prayer would save its followers, so how come it doesn't. I'm not saying prayer doesn't work, I'm just saying, why make it focused on the Abrahamic ? and why should people be killed for not worshipping it? Maybe I'm just skeptical of weak and powerless beings. That are bizarre on top of that.
Since people don't see it then it should be understandable that people are gonna have doubts about it or any ? . There are several broken promises from Jesus actually, Jesus never fulfilled all of the Old Testament promises. I think he was a good man deep down, but if he couldn't even fulfill all the Old Testament prophecies, how is Jesus keeping all the promises then? Somebody is lying. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »@kingblaze84 In regards to Numbers 21:5 and 6...there is a context to all of this. Way before this "complaint", ? gave Israel over to the Egyptians and were enslaved for quite a time. ? promised Israel that He will deliver them through Moses and did so in "miraculous" fashion. And this is a prime example of not believing in spite of the evidence. If ? parted the Red Sea before the eyes of the Israelites, that should have been enough to make ? their Lord. But, when times got rough out there in the desert, they forget that ? had done anything and want to go back to Egypt. They no longer believe in ? when He stopped working His Magic.
Yeah, I always found it interesting how the Israelites' faith would waver when their ? stopped working magic.
I suppose it's because it could have been any number of gods who could have worked those miracles, assuming those miracles happened to begin with. Many of the Israelites, rationally, could have believed those "miracles" were just random coincidences.
There's a reason Jews have one of the highest rates of atheism in the world, look at the Holocaust. The Bible ? didn't save any Jews when ? and his Nazis were killing them all over the place. Where was the Bible ? 's magic then lol
The Israelites were not displaying faith. They wanted to use ? for their own self interest...just like anyone else would if given the chance. When they saw they was not getting what they wanted from ? , they complained. They didn't care whether or not their deliverance from Egypt into the Promised Land served a higher purpose. They didn't care if it meant robbing Moses of the privilege of entering the land with them given ? used Him to get them there. Why be delivered from our circumstances when we are still in our sins?
That's the funny thing though, the Bible ? knows people are going to be skeptical. If people are going through hardships and they taste bread that tastes horrible and they're still hungry in the desert, shouldn't the Bible ? understand why people were complaining?
Of course some of the other Israelites were gonna worship other gods, they saw how other people in foreign lands were worshipping other gods and seemed to be blessed with tons of food and housing. Unlike the Israelites who kept having bad luck and were not having anything to themselves. The Abrahamic ? couldn't see that coming? So to make sure the jealousy of his ended, he told his followers to ? and massacre the ones who were complaining. Yeah that's a very nice thing to do.
Instead of proving himself and maybe blessing his people more, it said, "Ima ? ya'll, even your kids, if you keep complaining about me". Is this the behavior of a rational and supposedly all loving being? Hell no, instead of addressing their concerns better and rationally, it chose to act like Ted Bundy on steroids. How the hell is it gonna complain about people sinning then.
This issue isn't about what ? already knows. It's about man making a choice to chose ? based on what has already been said. Israel knew of the promise to them, yet they behaved as people who never heard it; that ? had done nothing to make good on His Promise.
You have come to your own conclusions about ? by the will to chose. Would it be right for ? to let you choose who you don't like? Would it be fair for ? to force Himself on you given what you believe about Him? You wouldn't enjoy Heaven if ? let you in because you would still be suspicious of Him.
That's fair and all but what's a little weird is how this ? of yours keeps breaking its promises, especially the New Testament version. So why would people keep trusting a being that keeps lying? The thread title is about lies.....Jesus said he would come quickly four times at least and 2,000 years later no one sees this guy. He also said prayers would work under his name, and always be answered but uhhh........that's not the case in Libya or parts of Nigeria. All those Christian girls kidnapped by Boko Haram didn't see any ? protecting them, despite the thousands of prayers on Twitter and Youtube.
So yeah, you can say I'd be suspicious of him lol. It would be rational to do so. Remember the Bible ? saying it would bring its people peace and yet Jews have yet to see any real peace in Israel?
Would you trust someone who lies to you over and over again?
? hasn't broken His Promise to man. But man has. The Bible pretty much tells the story of how man tries...and fails to keep our end of the bargain with ? and really being clueless to what that promise is. Along with the Jews, Jesus's disciples didn't have a clue the whole time they were with him. It was only after Jesus died and rose again that the light bulb came on.
The promise is that He saves us from sin through His Son Jesus. In our sin, we would have to pay for it with our souls and it is a debt we can never paid back. It is in this promise that people can find peace.
However, you seem to think that ? 's Promise is to deliver us from the bad circumstances of our lives. It's fine if He does, but that is not what it's about. What good is ? giving the material things of this world if it does nothing for the soul?
Well there isn't enough evidence of this ? of yours being alive anymore. Where is it? Why is it so powerless in saving its own followers, especially the Jews? Jesus said prayer would save its followers, so how come it doesn't. I'm not saying prayer doesn't work, I'm just saying, why make it focused on the Abrahamic ? and why should people be killed for not worshipping it? Maybe I'm just skeptical of weak and powerless beings. That are bizarre on top of that.
Since people don't see it then it should be understandable that people are gonna have doubts about it or any ? . There are several broken promises from Jesus actually, Jesus never fulfilled all of the Old Testament promises. I think he was a good man deep down, but if he couldn't even fulfill all the Old Testament prophecies, how is Jesus keeping all the promises then? Somebody is lying.
You know the Jews questioned whether Jesus fulfilled the law in the Bible so you are not alone. The Pharisees were good at doing that whenever Jesus did something they felt went against the law. I tried to lay out in a previous post what that promise is and how he did that. However it just seems like you are wanting something else. Salvation from sin is more than enough. Knowing that ? will overlook someone's condition through Jesus's sacrifice would bring peace if they believe it to be so. It would allow us to deal with self and with the world in the proper perspective.
It is also said that if Jesus didn't die and rise from the grave, then ? lied and we are still in our sin. If that is the truth, then we are eventually going to pay for it whether we believe in ? or not. We are already getting a glimpse of how bad things are getting in the world and no government, religion or ideology has done anything about it. If anything, these things are bringing out the worst in us. We set these things up in our lives to distract ourselves from what we don't want to see about ourselves. -
alissowack wrote: »soul rattler wrote: »alissowack wrote: »soul rattler wrote: »This is why salvation is such an idiotic concept.
G-d puts man in a position to fail, knowing they would surely fail, punishes them for failing, makes an elaborate plan to save SOME of them, and expects GRATITUDE for it?
? that. If the police planted coke on you then locked you up on drug charges, only to let you go months later, would you be greatful to them? If they claimed to have done it for your good, would you love them for granting you the experience? If you had a lawyer that was willing to fight the charges on your behalf, would you blame them for your predicament?
I think the police example is a bad one. Cops planting drugs on somebody means the accused didn't have a choice in the matter. The cop's intentions were to find someone guilty whether they were guilty of something or not. I doubt cops bust people to teach them some valuable life lesson. That just goes against how justice system is suppose to work. Now if I was falsely accused, I would feel some type of way about it, but my hope is that I can step back and see that it is in our sinful nature to lie on each other.
Being in a position to fail is totally different than failing. Jesus was in a desert yet he chose ? . You still have a choice to either do what's right or wrong.
I was referring to humanity and the fall of man. Adam and Eve didn't choose to be created, nor could they have understood the gravity of punishment that resulted from eating from the tree. In that regard, their hands we're tied.
Their hands were not tied. Adam and Eve didn't need to know the gravity of the consequence. They just need to trust ? with the things He said to do or not do. However, they placed their trust in what the serpent had to say.
What does it mean to be told you'll die when you have no idea what death is?
If I say, "don't post in this thread again or you'll vlopadorp", you won't even know what to truly make of it because you have no idea what "vlopadorp" is. -
@allissowack
If Jesus's death for his beliefs comforts you and helps you deal with the world and yourself, okay no problem. I just don't understand why the Bible ? turns into a massive killer or commands the deaths of others that don't want to pray or believe in it. If it wasn't for the Abrahamic ? 's support and co-signing of savage behavior at times, I wouldn't be as disgusted by it. The lies do not help either, I know we have a philosophical difference on whether it's lies Jesus tells or if it's, I don't know, whatever you say it is. At face value, he gave some misleading statements.
Mark 11:24
"Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours."
Ummm....that didn't happen in Nigeria with Boko Haram. Didn't work out in Libya. I've seen the prayers on Twitter for myself....prayers to Jesus didn't work those times. It didn't save him either.
And people are noticing how bad the world is getting in some ways, but it's not like THAT is gonna make people have more faith in the Abrahamic ? . If anything, it makes many people doubt it more. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »@allissowack
If Jesus's death for his beliefs comforts you and helps you deal with the world and yourself, okay no problem. I just don't understand why the Bible ? turns into a massive killer or commands the deaths of others that don't want to pray or believe in it. If it wasn't for the Abrahamic ? 's support and co-signing of savage behavior at times, I wouldn't be as disgusted by it. The lies do not help either, I know we have a philosophical difference on whether it's lies Jesus tells or if it's, I don't know, whatever you say it is. At face value, he gave some misleading statements.
Mark 11:24
"Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours."
Ummm....that didn't happen in Nigeria with Boko Haram. Didn't work out in Libya. I've seen the prayers on Twitter for myself....prayers to Jesus didn't work those times. It didn't save him either.
And people are noticing how bad the world is getting in some ways, but it's not like THAT is gonna make people have more faith in the Abrahamic ? . If anything, it makes many people doubt it more.
That has historically been proven false the only reason the church grew in the first place was because people were willing to die for their faith and prayers worked they worked for me if you actually read the bible you would know that jesus puts conditions to it.
? is not a genie or your personal errand boy -
kingblaze84 wrote: »@allissowack
If Jesus's death for his beliefs comforts you and helps you deal with the world and yourself, okay no problem. I just don't understand why the Bible ? turns into a massive killer or commands the deaths of others that don't want to pray or believe in it. If it wasn't for the Abrahamic ? 's support and co-signing of savage behavior at times, I wouldn't be as disgusted by it. The lies do not help either, I know we have a philosophical difference on whether it's lies Jesus tells or if it's, I don't know, whatever you say it is. At face value, he gave some misleading statements.
Mark 11:24
"Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours."
Ummm....that didn't happen in Nigeria with Boko Haram. Didn't work out in Libya. I've seen the prayers on Twitter for myself....prayers to Jesus didn't work those times. It didn't save him either.
And people are noticing how bad the world is getting in some ways, but it's not like THAT is gonna make people have more faith in the Abrahamic ? . If anything, it makes many people doubt it more.
That has historically been proven false the only reason the church grew in the first place was because people were willing to die for their faith and prayers worked they worked for me if you actually read the bible you would know that jesus puts conditions to it.
? is not a genie or your personal errand boy
Prayers might work but technically, we can pray to a number of things or no things and still have good luck. Some may have worse luck praying, word to Bobbi Christina and Bobby Brown. Notice all the luck the Greeks had praying to Zeus and Apollo, and all the luck the Egyptians had praying to Ra and others.
And I never said the Bible ? should act like a genie, but it should at least back up its own prophecies. Especially after 2000 years. It's pretty ridiculous but hey whatever works for you. -
soul rattler wrote: »alissowack wrote: »soul rattler wrote: »alissowack wrote: »soul rattler wrote: »This is why salvation is such an idiotic concept.
G-d puts man in a position to fail, knowing they would surely fail, punishes them for failing, makes an elaborate plan to save SOME of them, and expects GRATITUDE for it?
? that. If the police planted coke on you then locked you up on drug charges, only to let you go months later, would you be greatful to them? If they claimed to have done it for your good, would you love them for granting you the experience? If you had a lawyer that was willing to fight the charges on your behalf, would you blame them for your predicament?
I think the police example is a bad one. Cops planting drugs on somebody means the accused didn't have a choice in the matter. The cop's intentions were to find someone guilty whether they were guilty of something or not. I doubt cops bust people to teach them some valuable life lesson. That just goes against how justice system is suppose to work. Now if I was falsely accused, I would feel some type of way about it, but my hope is that I can step back and see that it is in our sinful nature to lie on each other.
Being in a position to fail is totally different than failing. Jesus was in a desert yet he chose ? . You still have a choice to either do what's right or wrong.
I was referring to humanity and the fall of man. Adam and Eve didn't choose to be created, nor could they have understood the gravity of punishment that resulted from eating from the tree. In that regard, their hands we're tied.
Their hands were not tied. Adam and Eve didn't need to know the gravity of the consequence. They just need to trust ? with the things He said to do or not do. However, they placed their trust in what the serpent had to say.
What does it mean to be told you'll die when you have no idea what death is?
If I say, "don't post in this thread again or you'll vlopadorp", you won't even know what to truly make of it because you have no idea what "vlopadorp" is.
But what does that have to do with trusting ? ? Adam and Eve may not have known what death was, but they should have known in their time in the garden that ? knew what's best for them. He hadn't done anything to betray their trust. But the serpent did.
And in regards to that "vlopadorp"...if I knew you to be trustworthy; that you mean well to all those you gave sound advice to, I would take your word for it even if I don't know what that word is. But, I don't trust you...and you shouldn't trust me either. I would want to know. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »@allissowack
If Jesus's death for his beliefs comforts you and helps you deal with the world and yourself, okay no problem. I just don't understand why the Bible ? turns into a massive killer or commands the deaths of others that don't want to pray or believe in it. If it wasn't for the Abrahamic ? 's support and co-signing of savage behavior at times, I wouldn't be as disgusted by it. The lies do not help either, I know we have a philosophical difference on whether it's lies Jesus tells or if it's, I don't know, whatever you say it is. At face value, he gave some misleading statements.
Mark 11:24
"Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours."
Ummm....that didn't happen in Nigeria with Boko Haram. Didn't work out in Libya. I've seen the prayers on Twitter for myself....prayers to Jesus didn't work those times. It didn't save him either.
And people are noticing how bad the world is getting in some ways, but it's not like THAT is gonna make people have more faith in the Abrahamic ? . If anything, it makes many people doubt it more.
But in what context are you using Mark 11:24? Are you using it in light of what ? has done already...or are you using ? to serve as some genie who churns up wishes.
But I'll risk it and go ahead and answer. He's a genie in your perspective. He is suppose to just give you stuff on command. You don't care if He doesn't care how He does it or why He does it...or whether someone is just playing Him like...OK, I conned Him to do this once; let me see if I can get Him to do it again.
When I come to ? in prayer, I come in light of what He has done through Jesus...which is more than enough. That sets my perspective on how I need to pray. My prayer in the difficult times of people's lives is that ? grants them a spiritual wellbeing; that their souls are comforted and given strength to persevere. I try not to pray for circumstances to get better or worse for I don't know how ? is using those circumstances in people's lives...for all I know, asking ? to bring about wealth and prosperity may bring out the worst in a person.
Prayer did "work" for Jesus. Through his sacrifice, he gets to one day be reunited with the people who trusted in His Father's Will for their lives. Jesus didn't see his death as a setback. He saw it as something that needed to happen and in the way that it needed to happen. -
@zzombie I should have quoted you if I paid attention to you using that "? is not a genie" post.
-
Technically, Prayer to ? is a privilege, and a spiritual blessing in Christ Jesus received by those who've been converted and those who are not spiritually dead in their sins. ? doesn't hear everyone's prayer. That why you know it's messed up when you look at mainstream Christianity on the TV having alien sinners trying pray themselves into being saved. Nowhere in the book did any conversion take place through simply praying, no , you have to go repent and go down in the water and be washed of sins first before you get the blessing of being in communication with ? to pray to him.
-
Somebody cosign this man.Technically, Prayer to ? is a privilege, and a spiritual blessing in Christ Jesus received by those who've been converted and those who are not spiritually dead in their sins. ? doesn't hear everyone's prayer. That why you know it's messed up when you look at mainstream Christianity on the TV having alien sinners trying pray themselves into being saved. Nowhere in the book did any conversion take place through simply praying, no , you have to go repent and go down in the water and be washed of sins first before you get the blessing of being in communication with ? to pray to him. -
alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »@allissowack
If Jesus's death for his beliefs comforts you and helps you deal with the world and yourself, okay no problem. I just don't understand why the Bible ? turns into a massive killer or commands the deaths of others that don't want to pray or believe in it. If it wasn't for the Abrahamic ? 's support and co-signing of savage behavior at times, I wouldn't be as disgusted by it. The lies do not help either, I know we have a philosophical difference on whether it's lies Jesus tells or if it's, I don't know, whatever you say it is. At face value, he gave some misleading statements.
Mark 11:24
"Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours."
Ummm....that didn't happen in Nigeria with Boko Haram. Didn't work out in Libya. I've seen the prayers on Twitter for myself....prayers to Jesus didn't work those times. It didn't save him either.
And people are noticing how bad the world is getting in some ways, but it's not like THAT is gonna make people have more faith in the Abrahamic ? . If anything, it makes many people doubt it more.
But in what context are you using Mark 11:24? Are you using it in light of what ? has done already...or are you using ? to serve as some genie who churns up wishes.
But I'll risk it and go ahead and answer. He's a genie in your perspective. He is suppose to just give you stuff on command. You don't care if He doesn't care how He does it or why He does it...or whether someone is just playing Him like...OK, I conned Him to do this once; let me see if I can get Him to do it again.
When I come to ? in prayer, I come in light of what He has done through Jesus...which is more than enough. That sets my perspective on how I need to pray. My prayer in the difficult times of people's lives is that ? grants them a spiritual wellbeing; that their souls are comforted and given strength to persevere. I try not to pray for circumstances to get better or worse for I don't know how ? is using those circumstances in people's lives...for all I know, asking ? to bring about wealth and prosperity may bring out the worst in a person.
Prayer did "work" for Jesus. Through his sacrifice, he gets to one day be reunited with the people who trusted in His Father's Will for their lives. Jesus didn't see his death as a setback. He saw it as something that needed to happen and in the way that it needed to happen.
Well he said what he said in the book, maybe the writers of the Bible misheard what he said. The words speak for itself, there are other passages very similar to that.
I find it interesting that his death wasn't seen as a setback but the prophecies weren't finished, and still haven't been after all this time. If you can let all that slide, good for you. You're more patient then me, cuz 2,000 plus years of prophecies not being fulfilled sounds like a hell of a setback. -
kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »@allissowack
If Jesus's death for his beliefs comforts you and helps you deal with the world and yourself, okay no problem. I just don't understand why the Bible ? turns into a massive killer or commands the deaths of others that don't want to pray or believe in it. If it wasn't for the Abrahamic ? 's support and co-signing of savage behavior at times, I wouldn't be as disgusted by it. The lies do not help either, I know we have a philosophical difference on whether it's lies Jesus tells or if it's, I don't know, whatever you say it is. At face value, he gave some misleading statements.
Mark 11:24
"Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours."
Ummm....that didn't happen in Nigeria with Boko Haram. Didn't work out in Libya. I've seen the prayers on Twitter for myself....prayers to Jesus didn't work those times. It didn't save him either.
And people are noticing how bad the world is getting in some ways, but it's not like THAT is gonna make people have more faith in the Abrahamic ? . If anything, it makes many people doubt it more.
But in what context are you using Mark 11:24? Are you using it in light of what ? has done already...or are you using ? to serve as some genie who churns up wishes.
But I'll risk it and go ahead and answer. He's a genie in your perspective. He is suppose to just give you stuff on command. You don't care if He doesn't care how He does it or why He does it...or whether someone is just playing Him like...OK, I conned Him to do this once; let me see if I can get Him to do it again.
When I come to ? in prayer, I come in light of what He has done through Jesus...which is more than enough. That sets my perspective on how I need to pray. My prayer in the difficult times of people's lives is that ? grants them a spiritual wellbeing; that their souls are comforted and given strength to persevere. I try not to pray for circumstances to get better or worse for I don't know how ? is using those circumstances in people's lives...for all I know, asking ? to bring about wealth and prosperity may bring out the worst in a person.
Prayer did "work" for Jesus. Through his sacrifice, he gets to one day be reunited with the people who trusted in His Father's Will for their lives. Jesus didn't see his death as a setback. He saw it as something that needed to happen and in the way that it needed to happen.
Well he said what he said in the book, maybe the writers of the Bible misheard what he said. The words speak for itself, there are other passages very similar to that.
I find it interesting that his death wasn't seen as a setback but the prophecies weren't finished, and still haven't been after all this time. If you can let all that slide, good for you. You're more patient then me, cuz 2,000 plus years of prophecies not being fulfilled sounds like a hell of a setback.
...pretty much what Satan did to Jesus in the desert. Satan quotes Psalms 91:11-12 to Jesus as a reason to throw himself down. Jesus knew what that scripture said, but he knew what Satan was using it for...so he quotes Deuteronomy 6:16. You want Mark 11:24 to support your perspective on the Bible.
When Jesus was crucified, his followers saw it as a set back. They were under the impression that he would come and establish political rule over the land, but he didn't come for that. Again, according to the Bible, he did do what he set out to do...save mankind from sin. That's more than enough. Now if you are referring to Jesus's return...if it happens, then it does. But, that is not the focus. People in the Old Testament who knew of Jesus coming never got a chance to see him, but I doubt they were sitting around waiting for some type of confirmation. -
alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »alissowack wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »@allissowack
If Jesus's death for his beliefs comforts you and helps you deal with the world and yourself, okay no problem. I just don't understand why the Bible ? turns into a massive killer or commands the deaths of others that don't want to pray or believe in it. If it wasn't for the Abrahamic ? 's support and co-signing of savage behavior at times, I wouldn't be as disgusted by it. The lies do not help either, I know we have a philosophical difference on whether it's lies Jesus tells or if it's, I don't know, whatever you say it is. At face value, he gave some misleading statements.
Mark 11:24
"Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours."
Ummm....that didn't happen in Nigeria with Boko Haram. Didn't work out in Libya. I've seen the prayers on Twitter for myself....prayers to Jesus didn't work those times. It didn't save him either.
And people are noticing how bad the world is getting in some ways, but it's not like THAT is gonna make people have more faith in the Abrahamic ? . If anything, it makes many people doubt it more.
But in what context are you using Mark 11:24? Are you using it in light of what ? has done already...or are you using ? to serve as some genie who churns up wishes.
But I'll risk it and go ahead and answer. He's a genie in your perspective. He is suppose to just give you stuff on command. You don't care if He doesn't care how He does it or why He does it...or whether someone is just playing Him like...OK, I conned Him to do this once; let me see if I can get Him to do it again.
When I come to ? in prayer, I come in light of what He has done through Jesus...which is more than enough. That sets my perspective on how I need to pray. My prayer in the difficult times of people's lives is that ? grants them a spiritual wellbeing; that their souls are comforted and given strength to persevere. I try not to pray for circumstances to get better or worse for I don't know how ? is using those circumstances in people's lives...for all I know, asking ? to bring about wealth and prosperity may bring out the worst in a person.
Prayer did "work" for Jesus. Through his sacrifice, he gets to one day be reunited with the people who trusted in His Father's Will for their lives. Jesus didn't see his death as a setback. He saw it as something that needed to happen and in the way that it needed to happen.
Well he said what he said in the book, maybe the writers of the Bible misheard what he said. The words speak for itself, there are other passages very similar to that.
I find it interesting that his death wasn't seen as a setback but the prophecies weren't finished, and still haven't been after all this time. If you can let all that slide, good for you. You're more patient then me, cuz 2,000 plus years of prophecies not being fulfilled sounds like a hell of a setback.
...pretty much what Satan did to Jesus in the desert. Satan quotes Psalms 91:11-12 to Jesus as a reason to throw himself down. Jesus knew what that scripture said, but he knew what Satan was using it for...so he quotes Deuteronomy 6:16. You want Mark 11:24 to support your perspective on the Bible.
When Jesus was crucified, his followers saw it as a set back. They were under the impression that he would come and establish political rule over the land, but he didn't come for that. Again, according to the Bible, he did do what he set out to do...save mankind from sin. That's more than enough. Now if you are referring to Jesus's return...if it happens, then it does. But, that is not the focus. People in the Old Testament who knew of Jesus coming never got a chance to see him, but I doubt they were sitting around waiting for some type of confirmation.
Okay you're more trusting than I am lol. I've always been the skeptical, thinking type. The only kind of ? I would worship would be a powerful one. It seems the kind of ? you worship doesn't fit into my criteria, and likely never will.
As a strong man physically and mentally, I dislike weakness from so called higher powers. Jesus claiming it would answer prayers for its followers and being unable to do so in major cases is a huge sign of weakness for me.
Because the Bible ? is unable to show its powers anymore, I can't in all honesty, even call it a ? . A ? is supposed to be powerful.....I don't see those characteristics in your ? in these modern times. But if you see them, good for you. I'll continue my heathen lifestyle in a meanwhile. -
this dude is under six feet and under 200 pounds and is talking about he's physically strong lmao lolololo.
this dude is also too apprehensive about the future to have children yet is talking about he's mentally strong lmao lololol -
this dude is under six feet and under 200 pounds and is talking about he's physically strong lmao lolololo.
this dude is also too apprehensive about the future to have children yet is talking about he's mentally strong lmao lololol
LMAO.....I've never lost a fight before, you thought I was exaggerating about that in the GNS? I wasn't.
And people can be mentally tough and not want kids. Everyone knows what works best for them. Was Wilt Chamberlain mentally weak??
