The Official Biggie Vs Jay-Z Thread...
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Good point...but now Jay is the face of HipHopBig fathered the style that Jigga used to get rich. Nah BDK fathered Jays style
At no point in Jay's career was he ever as good as Big in his day. Brooklyns Finest, I love The Dough, Young Gs.. they were on even playin fields
Jay used Big's blueprint to craft his albums, the whole multi singles on the album idea (Life After Death).. tht idea wasnt Biggies alone.. the album had 20+ songs. its only logical he would have more than one single
In Big's era he was the man, he held down the east when the west was on top. He was also the face of hip hop at the time. -
BDK influenced Jay and Biggie for sure but there is no way Jay did not take from Biggie's style. It's clear as day. Jay Z has been making rehashes of Biggie's LP's since Vol 1. Also Biggie changed the game from his debut and brought a whole coast back from the dark. Jay's debut wasn't even the best album of it's year. Again Jay and Big are Top 5 no doubt. Jay is a living legend and made his own lane. But there's a reason Jay can not let Big's legacy go cause he even knows deep down there is only one King. I feel bad for Jay cause I really believe he would of still blew up had Biggie lived and they would both be ruling the game but because of his untimely death, Big's Legend is frozen in time so it's like he had the perfect career. I mean serioulsy Big sold 17 Million off two LP's and two cut and past LP's. Jay Z in 11 LP's:
RD - Platinum
Vol 1 - Platinum
Vol 2 - 5x Platinum
Vol 3 - 3x Platinum
Dynasty - 2x Platinum
BP - 2x Platinum
BP 2 - 3x Platinum
BA - 3x Platinum
KC - 2x Platinum
AG - Platinum
BP3 - 2x Platinum
= 25x Platinum (11LPs)
RTD - 4x Platinum
LAD - 10x Platinum
BA - 2x Platinum
D - Platinum
= 17x Platinum (4 LP's)
Do the math, Big did more with Less. The fact Biggie sold 3 Million off cut and paste verses people already heard speaks volumes. His songs were more popular than Jay's during his era. Big's single charted better than Jay's. 11 #1 albums is Historic so again Jay is a Legend also and it can't be disputed but better than Biggie? Brooklyn's Jesus? No. One thing I will give Jay is sales wise, he's probably the most consistant in Hip Hop History. Every album went Platinum, damn. -
rapmastermind wrote: »BDK influenced Jay and Biggie for sure but there is no way Jay did not take from Biggie's style. It's clear as day. Jay Z has been making rehashes of Biggie's LP's since Vol 1. Also Biggie changed the game from his debut and brought a whole coast back from the dark. Jay's debut wasn't even the best album of it's year. Again Jay and Big are Top 5 no doubt. Jay is a living legend and made his own lane. But there's a reason Jay can not let Big's legacy go cause he even knows deep down there is only one King. I feel bad for Jay cause I really believe he would of still blew up had Biggie lived and they would both be ruling the game but because of his untimely death, Big's Legend is frozen in time so it's like he had the perfect career. I mean serioulsy Big sold 17 Million off two LP's and two cut and past LP's. Jay Z in 11 LP's:
RD - Platinum
Vol 1 - Platinum
Vol 2 - 5x Platinum
Vol 3 - 3x Platinum
Dynasty - 2x Platinum
BP - 2x Platinum
BP 2 - 3x Platinum
BA - 3x Platinum
KC - 2x Platinum
AG - Platinum
BP3 - 2x Platinum
= 25x Platinum (11LPs)
RTD - 4x Platinum
LAD - 10x Platinum
BA - 2x Platinum
D - Platinum
= 17x Platinum (4 LP's)
Do the math, Big did more with Less. The fact Biggie sold 3 Million off cut and paste verses people already heard speaks volumes. His songs were more popular than Jay's during his era. Big's single charted better than Jay's. 11 #1 albums is Historic so again Jay is a Legend also and it can't be disputed but better than Biggie? Brooklyn's Jesus? No. One thing I will give Jay is sales wise, he's probably the most consistant in Hip Hop History. Every album went Platinum, damn.
Your numbers are way off, about 20-25 mill off. -
lol this thread is crazy
Suicidal Thoughts > Jay's first 4 albums
Life After Death > Jay's entire Catalog
Ready To Die > Jay's Life -
Damn fam you erased JayZ's life for "Ready to Die".......thats just cruel.JokerzWyld wrote: »lol this thread is crazy
Suicidal Thoughts > Jay's first 4 albums
Life After Death > Jay's entire Catalog
Ready To Die > Jay's Life -
I co-sign this thread......I always thought Reasonable Doubt was better than Ready to Die, but I will be the first person to say that Biggie at his best would destroy Jay-Z......if Biggie was still alive, I know for a fact Biggie would likely be better, but Jay's longevity is hard to deny.
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C/s .Fazeem Blackall wrote: »Which is actually the point Biggie cannot keep up with Jay he is Dead Jay is Living, Jay has far passed him because of that plain reality and many other factors, Life and Death are not fair they are what they are though... -
kingblaze84 wrote: »I co-sign this thread......I always thought Reasonable Doubt was better than Ready to Die, but I will be the first person to say that Biggie at his best would destroy Jay-Z......if Biggie was still alive, I know for a fact Biggie would likely be better, but Jay's longevity is hard to deny.
i dont see how people can say that when big and jay got tracks togetha and jay outshines big on all em -
Damn fam you erased JayZ's life for "Ready to Die".......thats just cruel.
Nah man, just gettin these guys in here upset. -
Its like Jason Williams From Duke, Number 2 Pick, All The Talent In The World And Showed Flashes Of Being An Allstar In The League But Had His Career Cut Way To Short Due To That Motorcycle Crash So Well Never Know How Good He Could Have Been.....The Only Thing He Have Are The Flashes And Signs........Same Thing Wit Big
Big>>>>>>Pre-Blueprint Jay-z
Jay-Z Post Blueprint>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Big
Im Sorry Yall But The Blueprint Put Jay On Another Level -
Fazeem Blackall wrote: »Naw I broke that Dude long ago. He does not want his feelings hurt anymore then the truth of this thread is already doing. All arguments on Biggies side are based on he would have, was going to, almost did, but did not get a chance to. Not one dude has argued content, flow, styles, lyrical skill etc..naw just the Fantasy Factor and Impact which is even more debateable. Kills me because for every one with a argument based on fiction just know that an infinte more can be made from just as varied a spectrums. In the end only things that can be argued with substance to the matter is completely ignored...
Whats your point? lol, your only reason why Jay is better is because hes alive?!, hahaaahaa wtf is that?
Even your arab self knows Big laid the blueprint for every rapper today. And its still being followed, u mad? -
Before Big died Him, Jay, and Charlie B-More was suppose to be a group called "The Commision" and it was supose to be on some Firm (nas ,az ,and foxy) ? . If they woulda did that album Im positive that Big woulda did his thing and Jay was gonna look like his little man on that ? . If you listen to that verse on Victory Big was steppin up even more than he did on BK finest. I just think Jay and Charlie was gonna have a tough time not gettin outshined if he wouldna died before that album came about. It's not even like Im a Biggie fan like that but everybody actin like Jay Z is just this untouchable rapper when even Beans was outshining him all through the Dynasty album so cut it out with the bullshitness yall, PLEASE!!
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Before Big died Him, Jay, and Charlie B-More was suppose to be a group called "The Commision" and it was supose to be on some Firm (nas ,az ,and foxy) ? . If they woulda did that album Im positive that Big woulda did his thing and Jay was gonna look like his little man on that ? . If you listen to that verse on Victory Big was steppin up even more than he did on BK finest. I just think Jay and Charlie was gonna have a tough time not gettin outshined if he wouldna died before that album came about. It's not even like Im a Biggie fan like that but everybody actin like Jay Z is just this untouchable rapper when even Beans was outshining him all through the Dynasty album so cut it out with the bullshitness yall, PLEASE!!
Nah dude, to this day I still stand by the fact that both Jay and Nas are nicer than big, they were way better lyricist period. The thing that BIG had going for him was his flow and charisma, but as far as raw rhyming, he wasn't that great a lyricist. Ready to Die sounds dated as ? now, dudes delivery and lyrics sound rudamentary. -
Nah dude, to this day I still stand by the fact that both Jay and Nas are nicer than big, they were way better lyricist period. The thing that BIG had going for him was his flow and charisma, but as far as raw rhyming, he wasn't that great a lyricist. Ready to Die sounds dated as ? now, dudes delivery and lyrics sound rudamentary.
What makes you say that?
The real rhyming displayed on that album that doesn't exist today?
No auto-tune?
Real raw-gritty beats without synths and hand-claps to shake ya ass in the club?
The actual point and theme to the overall album, which artist today somehow forgot to implement in their own albums?
If it is not one of these things please tell me why you think it sounds "dated as f*ck" -
Pretty Fred wrote: »What makes you say that?
The real rhyming displayed on that album that doesn't exist today?
No auto-tune?
Real raw-gritty beats without synths and hand-claps to shake ya ass in the club?
The actual point and theme to the overall album, which artist today somehow forgot to implement in their own albums?
If it is not one of these things please tell me why you think it sounds "dated as f*ck"
Listen to the ? flow, yelling on the tracks and ? and the beats sound dated as ? , that album has not aged well. Biggie had his moments when he excelled lyrically like Victory but you gonna tell me Ready to die is anywhere near Illmatic or Reasonable Doubt lyrically, i think not. Like i said ill give Biggie flow, storytelling and charisma, but he was not a consistently great lyricist like that. -
Listen to the ? flow, yelling on the tracks and ? and the beats sound dated as ? , that album has not aged well. Biggie had his moments when he excelled lyrically like Victory but you gonna tell me Ready to die is anywhere near Illmatic or Reasonable Doubt lyrically, i think not. Like i said ill give Biggie flow, storytelling and charisma, but he was not a consistently great lyricist like that.
You sound like one of those people that are just mezmorized by the Fast rappin and think that's better lyrics. I'll but the track "Unbelievable" against any track on RD and I gurantee you Unbelievable dont get ? on terribly. I'll but "Kick in the door" against Any track on VOL 1 also. I wont even talk about who shot cha cause that wouldn't be fare to Jay.Big was always a little harder than him. He probably so glad Big died so he can shine. and again...If Jay was that great why was he so irrelevant when they both was alive? Nobody has answer that yet cuz deep down yall ? know Big was that ? on the east like him or not. And Pac crushed both guys but that's not here nor there. -
Listen to the ? flow, yelling on the tracks and ? and the beats sound dated as ? , that album has not aged well. Biggie had his moments when he excelled lyrically like Victory but you gonna tell me Ready to die is anywhere near Illmatic or Reasonable Doubt lyrically, i think not. Like i said ill give Biggie flow, storytelling and charisma, but he was not a consistently great lyricist like that.
1. Yes I do think it is equal to/better than illmatic.
2. Reasonable Doubt comes out 2 years after RtD, Jay has an advantage. -
southsil4lil wrote: »Its like Jason Williams From Duke, Number 2 Pick, All The Talent In The World And Showed Flashes Of Being An Allstar In The League But Had His Career Cut Way To Short Due To That Motorcycle Crash So Well Never Know How Good He Could Have Been.....The Only Thing He Have Are The Flashes And Signs........Same Thing Wit Big
Big>>>>>>Pre-Blueprint Jay-z
Jay-Z Post Blueprint>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Big
Im Sorry Yall But The Blueprint Put Jay On Another Level
Was Jason Williams ever considered one of the greats in his sport? Did he help revolutionize the game? This might be the worst analogy ever. -
Nah dude, to this day I still stand by the fact that both Jay and Nas are nicer than big, they were way better lyricist period. The thing that BIG had going for him was his flow and charisma, but as far as raw rhyming, he wasn't that great a lyricist. Ready to Die sounds dated as ? now, dudes delivery and lyrics sound rudamentary.
Biggie is considered one of Hip Hop Greatest Lyricist. What are you talking about? SMH @ "Ready To Die Sounds Dated". Classics are Classics man, they don't get old. You can still play that album all the way through. It's one of rap's greatest artistic achievements. In a Head to Head in 94, "Ready To Die" had more impact on the game than 'ILLmatic" though both are masterpieces. Biggie had one of the best verses on "Reasonable Doubt" yet it's better than "Ready To Die"? No. Jay Z again never saw a platinum award until Biggie stopped breathing. Again you can feel what you want about "Ready To Die" but that album changed rap music and was sick from top to bottom. Damn near flawless. -
Listen to the ? flow, yelling on the tracks and ? and the beats sound dated as ? , that album has not aged well. Biggie had his moments when he excelled lyrically like Victory but you gonna tell me Ready to die is anywhere near Illmatic or Reasonable Doubt lyrically, i think not. Like i said ill give Biggie flow, storytelling and charisma, but he was not a consistently great lyricist like that.
Lyricsim is only one aspect that makes an album great. "Ready To Die" had it all and LOL @ Biggie not being a consistantly great lyricist yet the entire rap game can't keep his lyrics out their mouth's including Jay Z and NaS the two you mentioned. How can Biggie be that sampled lyrically but not be a great lyricist? It just doesn't add up man. You don't sample someone who's weak at lyricisim. Biggie was the Ali of the East. Jay Z and NaS were not bigger than Him while he was alive. As for this debate, what does Jay Z do better than Biggie? His flow isn't better. His storytelling isn't anywhere near Big. His chrisma is there but Big was way more witty and had more chrisma. The only thing Jay got on Biggie is he's still alive. Biggie was agrueable the most complete rapper of all time. As for their callabo's, Jay did hold his own but outshine Big? No -
rapmastermind wrote: »Lyricsim is only one aspect that makes an album great. "Ready To Die" had it all and LOL @ Biggie not being a consistantly great lyricist yet the entire rap game can't keep his lyrics out their mouth's including Jay Z and NaS the two you mentioned. How can Biggie be that sampled lyrically but not be a great lyricist? It just doesn't add up man. You don't sample someone who's weak at lyricisim. Biggie was the Ali of the East. Jay Z and NaS were not bigger than Him while he was alive. As for this debate, what does Jay Z do better than Biggie? His flow isn't better. His storytelling isn't anywhere near Big. His chrisma is there but Big was way more witty and had more chrisma. The only thing Jay got on Biggie is he's still alive. Biggie was agrueable the most complete rapper of all time. As for their callabo's, Jay did hold his own but outshine Big? No
Lots of people are sampled but that doesnt make them great lyricist, Fat Joe is sampled, so is Snoop, and i don't consider none of them great lyricists. Biggie was Bigger than Nas and Jay because Biggie had the hottest young exec and a genius (Puffy) backing him, Biggie didnt even want to rhyme of the Juicy beat for ? sakes. Jay has a long catalog, way better wordplay, double entandres, vocab, multiple flows, stage presence, longevity,etc. Like i said there are alot of rappers better than Biggie period, Biggie just had the right situation to enhance his legacy (death, and Puffy's ear for whats hot and marketing). -
Biggie has never dropped anything ,wordplay and lyrics combined, as hard as what Jay spit on Pressure on Lupes Food and Liquor.
Some lines had like 4 different meanings.....real ? who listen to lyrics know what im talkin about. -
Fazeem Blackall wrote: »From style and flow to longetivity and versatility BIG has alway done what Jay Did and better minus someone else's Lyrics. ...
Fixed that for you.
Jigga is nice, but I'm mad you talkin bout "the fact he's still alive" has any bearing.
Side note: Was I the only one feeling like BE3 sounded manufactured? -
The Smooth One wrote: »Fixed that for you.
Jigga is nice, but I'm mad you talkin bout "the fact he's still alive" has any bearing.
Side note: Was I the only one feeling like BE3 sounded manufactured?
You mean BP3, what about it?
