Real Talk E-40>KRS One
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@Jamaica make that thread
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Turfaholic wrote: »genocidecutter wrote: »I mean when you really think about E-40 has better catologue, A longer career and is overall a much better rapper KRS One. Anyone agree?
LMAO everytime I come back to AHH I see nothing has changed. Gencutter I thought you were better than this, this is straight comedy lol. 40 invented slang. Kinda invented that weird but dope fast flow. Great hustler. Stayed relevant. And I'm a big fan actually, he's creative and dope. But KRS killed a guys CAREER. Was rhyming off the head killing people (Melle Mel, Biz, Shante Latin Quarters 1987) when MCs wasn't doing that yet. Pioneered gangsta rap. Flow on Poetry became the structure of modern rapping along with Rakim Eric B For President flow. My Philosophy sums up the rap industry in three verses back when no one was even talking to fans on that level. He did change with the times too, his best album was 93, he came out in 86. His albums were quality through 97. Nobody else, except maybe LL, can say that. He (and Chuck) made it cool to have knowledge in the hood, an almost impossible feat. And most of all, how many people copied/were directly influenced by 40s flow? When you hear Redman, Monie Love, Queen Latifah, Busta Rhymes, Chubb Rock, Ice Cube, MC Ren, Phife, 50 Cent, Jeru, Wise Intelligent, Chuck D you have heard KRS' influence. What MCs has 40 influenced? KRS impact is much much greater historically, he upped rap's vocab and flow on a bigger level than 40, even 40 respects KRS influence you can google interviews he says so. KRS is old and arrogant but hes one of the biggest pioneer/legends hip hop has if you too young to respect it do some research.
This post is flawed in so many wats
How is it flawed bro -
Breath Control was my ? too
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZC08CiNEXhA -
Don't get me wrong 40 is a great too, and he influenced the slang of a generation. He has bars to me, he's nice. And Mr Flamboyant (prolly my favorite), the Federal Album, his mid 90s ? , classic. And he changed the game with independent movement yes. But he didn't help shift a whole generation and those after to the flows of today like KRS/Ra/Kane/G Rap/ Slick Rick. To me a better choice for West Coast fans in this debate would be Cube. That's a closer match IMO.
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Yeah, Cube vs KRS would make a good thread. E-40 vs KRS is kinda uneven because they weren't around at the same time, or they didn't peak at the same time.
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Bklyn's_OX_KING wrote: »
The bold and underline can also be said about people making arguments against KRS ONE and regional classic arguments against up north.
Yes it can but in this time/era argument that the regional classic argument can be compared to, KRS falls short so you're not really making a point here.Bklyn's_OX_KING wrote: »and the other bold and underlined part shows how bias you are. KRS isn't trying to cater or adjust to an era. He's doing what he wants to do and he doesn't care if people like it or not.
That's a negative in the world of music. Sure, as an artist, the goal is to express yourself and do what you want but you have to remain fresh. Once your music becomes dated, you fade with the times. Outkast for example, did what they wanted on every album but from southernplayalistic to stankonia, they've been able to reinvent themselves. KRS hasn't done this like 40 has.
If you're going to make claims that I'm biased, you need to prove it. What I'm saying is facts.
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Stopitfive wrote: »this relevancy ? is hilarious and biased as ? ... because none of y'all can operationalize or measure it accurately and objectively...
Yes you can
On March 24, "Function" reached #62 on the U.S. Billboard Hot R&B/Hip-Hop Songs chart, before the album was released.[8] "Function" has also peaked at #42 on the Billboard Rap chart. It debuted on the Billboard Bubbling Under Hot 100 Singles chart at #22 on May 13, 2012.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Function_(song)
Show and prove for KRS. -
He did change with the times too, his best album was 93, he came out in 86.
Arguable. Most people will agree that his peak was the 80s as part of BDP. He had a spark when he started. -
made it cool to have knowledge in the hood, an almost impossible feat.
If you call spitting inaccuracies an incredible feat, sure. For example, You Must Learn was riddled with erroneous statements, like Benjamin Banneker invented the almanac. I can keep going. -
Dude called 40 the west coast Nore...lmmfao
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even 40 respects KRS influence you can google interviews he says so.
So what? I'm sure people like Bob Marley and the Beatles were influenced by artists not as great as themselves. -
yeah but by your logic Bob Marley and the Beatles aren't anywhere near as good as E-40 since they haven't released a hit record recently or changed up their style (aka dickrode disengenuously capitalized off that corny-ass hyphy 'movement' fad) to remain current with today's youth. -
Also where did this thing about KRS being too arrogant come from? That seems like an opinion that was repeated by someone ad-nauseam until by the follower mentality of the modern hip-hop audience it became accepted as fact.
What rapper isn't arrogant? When Kendrick says he's the best everybody rode his ? for a week (pause) but when KRS said it rappers just whined a lot and said "? dat ? " and got all mopey about it. I guess since nobody could handle him on the mic the next best thing was to attack his character. -
Sneak Dissa wrote: »yeah but by your logic Bob Marley and the Beatles aren't anywhere near as good as E-40 since they haven't released a hit record recently or changed up their style (aka dickrode disengenuously capitalized off that corny-ass hyphy 'movement' fad) to remain current with today's youth.
1. That isn't necessarily what I'm saying. Bob Marley and the Beatles are still relevant with today's youth-moreso than KRS One. They've remained fresh throughout the years. KRS music is stuck in an era. Bob and The Beatles are more relevant within their respective genres and within music as a whole with people of all age groups
2. Who's to say 40 is ? riding a movement? Isn't he a rapper? Isn't he a rapper from the Bay? It's not crazy to imagine his music might reflect those facts. -
That's the problem. NY has no current sound to serve as a backdrop for artists like KRS. If you can't reinvent your sound, you're going to be swept away. You can call it a fad, corny, or whatever but it exists and it represents an area and its relevant.
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I disagree. Yes he had a huge spark in 86 because he along with Ra were spiting different flows and topics from who came before them. But unlike Ra and Kane (not Grap), he started out ill and got better. He was using iller punchlines in 93 than dudes 10 yrs below his age (she got stomped so bad she turned to wine, if your name aint arrested development then save your speech lol). As sick as Criminal Minded and By Any Means Is, Boom Bap most KRS fans would agree is his peak. -
Yo g, 40 water aint Marley or the Beatles though lol. You putting him over Cube and Pac, Snoop, Too Short the way you're talking (far as West Coast MCs)...of course you entitled to that, but not too many outside the Bay gonna agree with that. When E-40 makes ? start reading books at the height of the ? era, when he can lecture at Harvard and Yale, when the Source, Rap Pages, Vibe, and fans consider him one of the best live performers of all time for like 14 yrs (they was still saying it in 2000), then I'll say he's more talented than KRS. -
If you gonna quote though g, quote Why Is That also. His biblical references are correct. Beef- the ? is correct lol. Black Cop- correct lol. I can keep going too lol.
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If you gonna quote though g, quote Why Is That also. His biblical references are correct. Beef- the ? is correct lol. Black Cop- correct lol. I can keep going too lol.
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
I'll quote the song Beef:See cows live under fear and stress
Trying to think what's gonna happen next
Fear and stress can become a part of you
In your cells and blood, this is true
So when the cow is killed, believe it
You preserve those cells, you freeze it
Thaw it out with the blood and season it
Then you sit down and begin eatin it
In your body, it's structure becomes your structure
All the fear and stress of another
^^^ This is not true. -
Yo g, 40 water aint Marley or the Beatles though lol.
I never said he was. And that's not the point anyway. I used them as examples to demonstrate a larger argument. I guess you missed that. Go back and read again.
Encouraging someone to skim through any random book and lecturing at Harvard doesn't automatically make you a better MC. If so, please explain how. Also being a good performer doesn't equate to being the best rapper. Again, if so, please explain how. For instance, Flava Flav was a good performer in his day but he was never a great rapper. -
I disagree. Yes he had a huge spark in 86 because he along with Ra were spiting different flows and topics from who came before them. But unlike Ra and Kane (not Grap), he started out ill and got better. He was using iller punchlines in 93 than dudes 10 yrs below his age (she got stomped so bad she turned to wine, if your name aint arrested development then save your speech lol). As sick as Criminal Minded and By Any Means Is, Boom Bap most KRS fans would agree is his peak.
Return of the Boom Bap has never really been recognized as his best material. Boom Bap being superior to everything else in his discography, especially Criminal Minded and By Any Means Necessary seems more opinion than fact in your case.
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I
I got your original point. That is your opinion that The Beatles were more talented than the blues guys, its not objective fact, taste dictates how you feel about things like that. As well as your opinion that KRS is some vastly inferior artist compared to E-40 ( I don't think facts back this up, KRS' contributions have been documented, whether they matter to you or not.) But I quoted 40 because musicians tend to have a better perspective on talent than fans because they know what it takes to create.Yo g, 40 water aint Marley or the Beatles though lol.
I never said he was. And that's not the point anyway. I used them as examples to demonstrate a larger argument. I guess you missed that. Go back and read again.
Encouraging someone to skim through any random book and lecturing at Harvard doesn't automatically make you a better MC. If so, please explain how. Also being a good performer doesn't equate to being the best rapper. Again, if so, please explain how. For instance, Flava Flav was a good performer in his day but he was never a great rapper.
Also, you must just not like KRS. I cant take you serious if your comparing him to Flavor Flav, you're not debating anymore just saying crazy stuff lol. Flava Flav is a hypeman. KRS is considered one of the greatest MCs ever in many polls over the years for lyrics, shows, battle ability. Don't let your disdain for KRS cloud your judgement g. -
I disagree. Yes he had a huge spark in 86 because he along with Ra were spiting different flows and topics from who came before them. But unlike Ra and Kane (not Grap), he started out ill and got better. He was using iller punchlines in 93 than dudes 10 yrs below his age (she got stomped so bad she turned to wine, if your name aint arrested development then save your speech lol). As sick as Criminal Minded and By Any Means Is, Boom Bap most KRS fans would agree is his peak.
Return of the Boom Bap has never really been recognized as his best material. Boom Bap being superior to everything else in his discography, especially Criminal Minded and By Any Means Necessary seems more opinion than fact in your case.
As far as flows, lyrics, beats, punchlines...while Criminal Minded is more important and groundbreaking, By Any Means was more penetrating, Boom Bap was his peak to me. Listen to the flow on I Must Rock The Mic, he wasn't doing that on Criminal Minded. We can agree to disagree I guess but to me 93 KRS was iller than 86 KRS which elevates him even higher in my eyes as an MC. -
If you gonna quote though g, quote Why Is That also. His biblical references are correct. Beef- the ? is correct lol. Black Cop- correct lol. I can keep going too lol.
Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
I'll quote the song Beef:See cows live under fear and stress
Trying to think what's gonna happen next
Fear and stress can become a part of you
In your cells and blood, this is true
So when the cow is killed, believe it
You preserve those cells, you freeze it
Thaw it out with the blood and season it
Then you sit down and begin eatin it
In your body, it's structure becomes your structure
All the fear and stress of another
^^^ This is not true.
Genesis Chapter 11 Verse 10
Explains the Genealogy of Shem
Shem was a Black Man
In Africa
If you repeat this fact they cant laugh at you
Genesis 14 Verse 13
Abraham steps on the scene \
Being a descendent of Shem which is a fact
means \
Abraham too was Black
^^^^^
that is true
and the beef stuff, I'm sure you could find a hippie who says its true lol.
I'm sure 40 and all other MC's have inaccuracies, misstatements, etc in their catalogue, not just the Blastmaster. -
Sneak Dissa wrote: »yeah but by your logic Bob Marley and the Beatles aren't anywhere near as good as E-40 since they haven't released a hit record recently or changed up their style (aka dickrode disengenuously capitalized off that corny-ass hyphy 'movement' fad) to remain current with today's youth.
1. That isn't necessarily what I'm saying. Bob Marley and the Beatles are still relevant with today's youth-moreso than KRS One. They've remained fresh throughout the years. KRS music is stuck in an era. Bob and The Beatles are more relevant within their respective genres and within music as a whole with people of all age groups
2. Who's to say 40 is ? riding a movement? Isn't he a rapper? Isn't he a rapper from the Bay? It's not crazy to imagine his music might reflect those facts.
Don't ever compare Youth Hip Hop fans to any other fans.
They're more into what's hot today.
The Youth Hip Hop fans think Nas fell off since a decade ago.
Do I take them seriously?
