Yeshua aka Jesus The Christ Son of ? discussion thread...
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blue falcon wrote: »1. Paul was also mistaken for a roman ? . You ever see statues of roman gods? They did not look black. And by the time Paul was around the Romans and Greeks had conquered egypt. The Ptolyemic dynasty was 400 years of white greek rule over egypt.
2. Where in scripture does it say that the hebrews were black?
Pavlos (Paul) waz mistaken 4 an "Egyptian" Egyptianz were B-L-A-C-K!! -
blue falcon wrote: »oh your right you said in scripture jews were mistaken for egyptian. But there aren't "countless times" in the bible where this happens.
So what that doesn't mean they were mistaken for Arabish or white lokkin people, U LOST!!! -
The example you give is impossible since there is no other way for a book to be assembled.
However if a threw a bunch of hydrogen and oxygen together I would not be surprised if they formed water.
If you place a bunch of hydrogen in one place I would not be surprised if heavier elements formed. This is how our sun works.
Put enough matter and gravity together and you will get a solar system.
When I am confronted by the unknown such what caused the big bang or how did life arise I do not retreat to the intellectauly indefensible position of ? but rather to the pattern the universe has seemed to laid out for me. Namely that natural processes without a divine hand can explain even these amazing events.
Exactly it is impossible. Just like the non-sense you believe in.
Where does this matter come from? Where? Everything comes from something. So tell me where oxygen and hydrogen originated from to begin with?
Explain how nothing can produce something.
If you wanted to grow an apple tree, can you just stare at the ground and expect an apple tree to grow out of it? No! You need seeds. You need something in order to produce something. Everything has a source, unless the ultimate source is eternal. Now can you please tell me how nothing can produce something. -
Pavlos (Paul) waz mistaken 4 an "Egyptian" Egyptianz were B-L-A-C-K!!
And again you are forgetting that by this time Rome and Greece had taken over. Egypt had white pharoahs for 400 years. So no simply because they were Egyptians doesn't make them black. Paul was also mistaken for a greek ? (correction when I said roman earlier) and if you've ever seen statues of Greek Gods they are most definately not black. -
blue falcon wrote: »And again you are forgetting that by this time Rome and Greece had taken over. Egypt had white pharoahs for 400 years. So no simply because they were Egyptians doesn't make them black. Paul was also mistaken for a greek ? (correction when I said roman earlier) and if you've ever seen statues of Greek Gods they are most definately not black.
I see your point. But what do you say about Joseph and his brothers, Moses, etc getting mistaken for Egyptians in the Old Testament? If they were black and the Romans looked at the Jews as lower on the totem pole, why would they breed with them? I'm sure there were some Romans who smashed a couple Jews, but was it enough to make the color of the Jews lighter as a whole? Most likely not. -
So what that doesn't mean they were mistaken for Arabish or white lokkin people, U LOST!!!
The only 2 times I can remember off top is when Paul was mistaken for an egyptian but at this time in history Greek and Roman armies had conquered egypt and had white greek rulers for over 400 years. And Moses who wasn't necessarily mistaken for an egyptian but it was said that he was taken to Pharoah's daughter for a son. That only means he was adopted. White people adopt black babies and vise versa. But maybe you can show me other examples. I've heard people say that how could a white baby (Jesus) hide in Egypt where there are black people? But this again doesn't take into account the fact that Egypt has always been visited by foreigners, had foreign rulers and had been conquered by the greeks and romans. -
Don't be mistaken I'm not trying to prove "white" Jesus only to discredit the false bible readigns that "prove' he's white. And by relation the facetious idea that we need to base doctrine or theology around the skin color of the jews and Jesus.
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I see your point. But what do you say about Joseph and his brothers, Moses, etc getting mistaken for Egyptians in the Old Testament? If they were black and the Romans looked at the Jews as lower on the totem pole, why would they breed with them? I'm sure there were some Romans who smashed a couple Jews, but was it enough to make the color of the Jews lighter as a whole? Most likely not.
Moses wasn't mistaken he was adopted.
Joseph wasn't mistaken he was a hebrew slave at first who through his prophetic powers ascended to power.
Why would romans breed with hebrews if they were seen as lower? Why did whites breed with their black slaves? Why did the English breed with the Scots of Irish? Why did whites breed with native americans? -
DoUwant2go2Heaven? wrote: »Exactly it is impossible. Just like the non-sense you believe in.
Where does this matter come from? Where? Everything comes from something. So tell me where oxygen and hydrogen originated from to begin with?
Explain how nothing can produce something.
If you wanted to grow an apple tree, can you just stare at the ground and expect an apple tree to grow out of it? No! You need seeds. You need something in order to produce something. Everything has a source, unless the ultimate source is eternal. Now can you please tell me how nothing can produce something.
I don't have to explain how nothing can produce something as it is not one of my contentions. According to the laws we understand in this universe Matter and Energy are eternal. They can not be created or destroyed. The Big Bang transferred energy from the scalar fields that make up the rest of the universe into our little spacetime expansion. Some of this energy was converted to matter. The scalar fields that make up the universe outside our spacetime piece are eternal. They operate outside the constraints of time. -
blue falcon wrote: »The only 2 times I can remember off top is when Paul was mistaken for an egyptian but at this time in history Greek and Roman armies had conquered egypt and had white greek rulers for over 400 years. And Moses who wasn't necessarily mistaken for an egyptian but it was said that he was taken to Pharoah's daughter for a son. That only means he was adopted. White people adopt black babies and vise versa. But maybe you can show me other examples. I've heard people say that how could a white baby (Jesus) hide in Egypt where there are black people? But this again doesn't take into account the fact that Egypt has always been visited by foreigners, had foreign rulers and had been conquered by the greeks and romans.
The Joseph story. His brothers thought he was actually an Egyptian ruler. -
blue falcon wrote: »Moses wasn't mistaken he was adopted.
Joseph wasn't mistaken he was a hebrew slave at first who through his prophetic powers ascended to power.
Why would romans breed with hebrews if they were seen as lower? Why did whites breed with their black slaves? Why did the English breed with the Scots of Irish? Why did whites breed with native americans?
The enslaved Hebrews were not aware that Prince Moses was Hebrew.
Joseph's brothers mistook their own brother for an Egyptian ruler. They did not recognize him.
I stated that I'm sure that a few people was smashing the Hebrews. But was it enough to change the overall physical appearance of the Hebrew? No. Just like Whites didn't lighten the color of Native Americans, black slaves, etc. -
The enslaved Hebrews were not aware that Prince Moses was Hebrew.
Joseph's brothers mistook their own brother for an Egyptian ruler. They did not recognize him.
I stated that I'm sure that a few people was smashing the Hebrews. But was it enough to change the overall physical appearance of the Hebrew? No. Just like Whites didn't lighten the color of Native Americans, black slaves, etc.
THE TRUE BIBLICAL HEBREWS WAKE UP BLACK MAN/ WOMEN YOUR NOT AFRICAN YOU WHERE PUSHED OUT OF ISRAEL IN 70 AD BY TITUS AND VESPASIAN THE ROMANS INTO WEST AFRICA !!!!!!!!
THE 12 TRIBES OF ISRAEL
JUDAH- American Blacks
BENJAMIN- West Indian Blacks
LEVI- Haitians
SIMEON- Dominicans
ZEBULON- Black Indians Guatemala to Panama(Mayans)
EPHRAIM- Puerto Ricans
MANASSEH- Cubans
GAD- Native-American Indians
REUBEN- Seminole Indians
ASHER- Columbia to Uruguay (Incas)
ISSACHAR- Mexicans (Aztecs)
NAPTHALI- Argentina/Chile -
I don't have to explain how nothing can produce something as it is not one of my contentions. According to the laws we understand in this universe Matter and Energy are eternal. They can not be created or destroyed. The Big Bang transferred energy from the scalar fields that make up the rest of the universe into our little spacetime expansion. Some of this energy was converted to matter. The scalar fields that make up the universe outside our spacetime piece are eternal. They operate outside the constraints of time.
The sad thing about what you typed is that you actually believe it. Fascinating Whar. -
The enslaved Hebrews were not aware that Prince Moses was Hebrew.
Joseph's brothers mistook their own brother for an Egyptian ruler. They did not recognize him.
I stated that I'm sure that a few people was smashing the Hebrews. But was it enough to change the overall physical appearance of the Hebrew? No. Just like Whites didn't lighten the color of Native Americans, black slaves, etc.
So what? That doesn't prove he was black.
Was that because He was black or because He was wearing the garb of an egyptian statesman. Can you prove that only blacks in egypt were in positions of power?
But your overall argument pre-supposes that the hebrews were black. I could care less one way or the other but the arguments supporting this are weak at best. -
blue falcon wrote: »So what? That doesn't prove he was black.
Was that because He was black or because He was wearing the garb of an egyptian statesman. Can you prove that only blacks in egypt were in positions of power?
But your overall argument pre-supposes that the hebrews were black. I could care less one way or the other but the arguments supporting this are weak at best.
Okay. If the Hebrews weren't the same color as Egyptians, how would they mistake him for an Egyptian? We already established that Egyptians during that time were black. Why would someone of a different race rule over the land? That's not logical or probable. Of course the rulers of Egypt were the same color as the people of the land. And the Egyptians' rulers were usually of the same family. If one was of a different color then all of them had to be. You say you don't care about the color of the mashiac, but your persistence against logical evidence proves otherwise. -
Okay. If the Hebrews weren't the same color as Egyptians, how would they mistake him for an Egyptian? We already established that Egyptians during that time were black. Why would someone of a different race rule over the land? That's not logical or probable. Of course the rulers of Egypt were the same color as the people of the land. And the Egyptians' rulers were usually of the same family. If one was of a different color then all of them had to be. You say you don't care about the color of the mashiac, but your persistence against logical evidence proves otherwise.
Sure about that?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ptolemy_I_Soter -
DoUwant2go2Heaven? wrote: »
You have to be aware that he was the one who initiated the Ptolemaic Dynasty. Come on son... -
You have to be aware that he was the one who initiated the Ptolemaic Dynasty. Come on son...
And he ruled egypt. He was Pharaoh, he wasn't the same color as the Egyptians.
Also egyptians and hebrews were of similar skin color. Egyptian skin color is not like sub-Saharan African skin color. The difference in skin complexion between the Egyptians and Hebrews are very minimal. -
7 pages in, I'm too late to care enough to debate this with any of you dumb geeks. But the Brady's ain't going to Detroit when they want to blend in. He was black, same as his father, get over it.
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Okay. If the Hebrews weren't the same color as Egyptians, how would they mistake him for an Egyptian? We already established that Egyptians during that time were black. Why would someone of a different race rule over the land? That's not logical or probable. Of course the rulers of Egypt were the same color as the people of the land. And the Egyptians' rulers were usually of the same family. If one was of a different color then all of them had to be. You say you don't care about the color of the mashiac, but your persistence against logical evidence proves otherwise.
1. He could have been wearing the same clothes as the egyptians or an egyptian ruler. Some how the Egyptians could tell the difference between them and enslave them. Care to account for this?
2. Where ALL the egyptians black and were all egyptians that were in positions of power black? That has not been established.
3. The Ptolyemic dynasty for 400 years assumed the title Pharoah. Why would they want to rule over a land of of people of a different race? Why did the Dutch, French, English etc rule over African nations?
4. Did they do this without exception? Did the egyptians never adopt people into the family?
5. I don't care but misusing the bible and history to prove he was black in an effort to elevate the importance of blackness is just as abominable as whites doing the same. -
well i dont do the bible or any religion at all but jesus was black if he was real. if you go back in jesus's family tree you'll see he was related to ham the same one who was cursed to be black. then you have to look at a couple of things the bible will never discuss is that the first people on earth were/is black so that would mean ? (i dont believe in ? ) has to be black.
i also read the scriptures that you put out about being bright or light and someone said no person can shine and i disagree. black people can shine bright like the sun. let me explain. have you ever seen blacks from nubia (africa) so black they blue or purple? i know you have so let me go deeper. when you see a flame, usually at the bottom it's the color blue, then in the middle its purple and at top it burns white hot. well you can use this same equation or theory i have to black people. once a person gets so dark they can shine white hot meaning knowledge, wisdom, soul, spirt, and body are one. hence the sun burns white hot and if you look at the sun its actually black. so if you get black enough you can burn bright or white hot like the sun -
The Lonious Monk wrote: »I dont' really care about this whole racial argument of Jesus because I think people who do that are missing the point of his teachings altogether. Still there is some bad argumentation being done here, and I feel the need to point it out.
Though I do agree that this line probably isn't designed to make people believe Jesus was black, your belief that it suggests he was white is faulty too. The problem is that you and the others are hung up on color. The writer isn't emphasizing color at all. The writer is talking more about brilliance, as in Jesus gave off a glow like a heated metal. This line isn't addressing skin color at all. You make this same basic mistake throughout your argument.
You're right here, no complaint. I'll only point out that hair being white like wool, doesn't suggest anything about race at all.
Now I'm not sure why you put any of that up. First, a couple of those verses were talking about Jesus' raiment shining white. Raiment is clothing so this isn't a commentary on skin color at all. Secondly, you seem to be suggesting that Jesus isn't black because the verses keep referring to him shining brilliantly. Frankly, that is just a stupid stance to take. Do white people or any other light skinned people shine? No. Clearly these verses are talking about an inhuman brilliance. Jesus' skin color isn't being addressed at all. What is being described is the fact that he seems to be giving off some type of radiant energy. He could give that off whether his skin was white, black, or purple. Lastly, you give a scripture that mentions sins and compares them to the colors white and red. Again, I don't even see what this has to do with an argument of race. The verse is talking about a person's sin. The red is tying those sins to blood. The white is to signify that they have been purified. This has nothing to do with Jesus' skin tone at all.
I know that your intentions are to refute what others have been saying regarding the race of Jesus. That's all well and good. The problem is I think you did that, and then went on to make claims or suggestions that were just as bad as the ones they made, and actually probably a bit worse.
you have very valid points but the only reason i would believe or entertain the idea that jesu was black or brown skin is because he was hated and persecuted just like the black man. They preferred to set free Barnabis a well known murderer while jesus was a righteous man doing ? 's work. the black man suffers the same hatred from all nations. why is that? -
If U've "heard" of this before and you STILL r saying he didn't exist, this provez:
1. U wasted all that time "typing" about him not existing, which he DID!
2. If ya can't figure this simple thing out, how can ya figure/teach other important thingz in life??
3. U r a STUPID ? -FUKA GTFOH NOW!!!
1. I was being saracastic STUPID MUTHAFUKA!
2. You saying he existed and proving he existed are two different thing. At least those other guys tried to prove it.
You seem like one of those ? smart dudes because I really had a hard time trying to understand what the ? you were talking about. "if ya cafnjt...how ya figure/tehch?????WTF...Go sit your ? down somewhere man....seriously. -
Jesus or Jesus bar-Abbas anyone?? I find it interesting that it was supposedly Jesus the Christ or Barabbas whose name just so happens to mean "Son of the Father" that were to be cruxified. So we have two people running around named Jesus at the same time supposedly, ones name actually means "Son of the Father" and one claims to be the son of ? who he just so happens to refer to as "father". Hmmm interesting...
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bless the child wrote: »Jesus or Jesus bar-Abbas anyone?? I find it interesting that it was supposedly Jesus the Christ or Barabbas whose name just so happens to mean "Son of the Father" that were to be cruxified. So we have two people running around named Jesus at the same time supposedly, ones name actually means "Son of the Father" and one claims to be the son of ? who he just so happens to refer to as "father". Hmmm interesting...
I could of sworn Jesus' name during that time was Yeshua ben Yosef
