who better? westbrook or iverson
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Son... Every game against the Lakers except gm 3 were close. You think the Sixers were gonna waltz over them??? -
ericb4prez wrote: »Peezy_Jenkins wrote: »ericb4prez wrote: »Peezy_Jenkins wrote: »ericb4prez wrote: »Im convinced ? jus don't like Russ cuz he doesn't defer to KD lol
im convinced ? really think russ is better than kd and will let him slide for the same things they'll criticize other players for. or in other words, im convinced ? are delusional
Funny cuz you never told me why KD is better than Russ and you stickin up for AI
some things shouldnt have to be explained bruh.
Lmao so basically you don't have a strong argument
And how is Russ a better scorer, passer, and defender than AI
*raises eyebrows* -
SheerExcellence wrote: »I'm amazed you ppl can take a second fiddle who has had a nice six week run and put him ahead of a first ballot hall of famer
Those of you saying Westbrook is much better...Iverson carried a team for years and terrorized the nba, putting fear into every opponents hearts like he was shaq during his peak run
In the 2001 playoffs he put on a show, dropping 40+ and 50 a couple out times as he played lights out ball
Putting up numbers on a historic playoff run is very important, having great Analytics all season its great, but westbrook has not done the post season out of his mind playing yet. Iverson had already done that his fifth year.
If westbrook can keep his current pace up for a full season and an extended playoff run then I will be willing to put him over iverson, but we all know there is no way he can keep this up...he will either get injured or tire himself out.
Lastly, we can't look past the rules changes. Iverson played in a time that was much more physical. Guys were laid out, esp little guards driving the lane. Iverson would routinely get up and keep coming. Westbrook and these current guys, you can't touch em, watch the old iverson highlights and see how much punishment he takes. If iverson played in today's nba where they can't touch you, he might have damn near fifty a night.
Well ? you could say that about Bird, MJ, The Iceman, Pistol Pete, Kareem, Malone, Clyde, The Dream, etc -
AI did a lot with what some would call a little, however that little was built for him they got players that complemented his style.
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Focal Point wrote: »ericb4prez wrote: »Peezy_Jenkins wrote: »ericb4prez wrote: »Peezy_Jenkins wrote: »ericb4prez wrote: »Im convinced ? jus don't like Russ cuz he doesn't defer to KD lol
im convinced ? really think russ is better than kd and will let him slide for the same things they'll criticize other players for. or in other words, im convinced ? are delusional
Funny cuz you never told me why KD is better than Russ and you stickin up for AI
some things shouldnt have to be explained bruh.
Lmao so basically you don't have a strong argument
And how is Russ a better scorer, passer, and defender than AI
*raises eyebrows*
*Smacks eye*
A.I. Had like .6 assists less with far less to pass to....sounds like he's the better scorer
A.I. Clearly got more to his offensive arsenal....not even close
Russ not a good defender so that's a wash
I was trolling with the Kings comment mostly
I'm done with this thread though -
I ? with Westbrook and Iverson. But y'all do know as far the assist argument goes ? have to make the shots for a player to have assist right? Russ is surrounded by shooters.
Iverson had KVH and a young Kyle Korver for a minute. Aaron Mckie and Larry Hughes were prolly his best teammates in Philly offensively since they got Stackhouse outta there real quick.
CP3, not better than Russ or Iverson. I would take a healthy/in shape Baron Davis over CP3. Yea I said it. -
Focal Point wrote: »ericb4prez wrote: »Peezy_Jenkins wrote: »ericb4prez wrote: »Peezy_Jenkins wrote: »ericb4prez wrote: »Im convinced ? jus don't like Russ cuz he doesn't defer to KD lol
im convinced ? really think russ is better than kd and will let him slide for the same things they'll criticize other players for. or in other words, im convinced ? are delusional
Funny cuz you never told me why KD is better than Russ and you stickin up for AI
some things shouldnt have to be explained bruh.
Lmao so basically you don't have a strong argument
And how is Russ a better scorer, passer, and defender than AI
*raises eyebrows*
*Smacks eye*
A.I. Had like .6 assists less with far less to pass to....sounds like he's the better scorer
A.I. Clearly got more to his offensive arsenal....not even close
Russ not a good defender so that's a wash
I was trolling with the Kings comment mostly
I'm done with this thread though
*rubs temples*
Is Russ a better defender than AI, yes or no
What does AI have in his arsenal that Russ doesn't
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When ? are at the top of their game everybody wanna come with the comparisons.....stop.
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No, ? that. The ? that bothers me is when nggas act like nothing,that happened in the past can ever be eclipsed, and that somehing thats happening RIGHT NOW, cant be historic
Russ is avg 27, 8apg, 7rpg...believe it or not, even Bron has only done that once. A guy who may finish as top 3 all time, and even he did that ONCE. At 6'8! RW 6'3!
This is history, gotdamnit, respect it lol -
You need to go eat a snickers. -
fortyacres&amule wrote: »AI , you ? caught in the moment
This basically sums it up and whoever said cp3>AI ya'll on ? lol -
EmM HoLLa. wrote: »This ? got me kinda upset lol.. I can't believe you ? .. hahaha.. Yo son.. Let me ask again did y'all actually watch Iverson?..
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En-Fuego22 wrote: »
Westbrook can just posted him up all dayInglewood_B wrote: »Easy way to get everyone on the same page, argument wise, since yall kinda arguing 2 different points.
1 on 1 in their primes, who you got?
I got Westbrook
Like a 3 inch difference in height. It ain't that serious.
Not saying it's an extremely dramatic difference, but it's damn sure significant.
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Shizlansky wrote: »En-Fuego22 wrote: »
Westbrook can just posted him up all dayInglewood_B wrote: »Easy way to get everyone on the same page, argument wise, since yall kinda arguing 2 different points.
1 on 1 in their primes, who you got?
I got Westbrook
Like a 3 inch difference in height. It ain't that serious.
And almost 40 pounds and hella aggressive.
So Jordan n Kobe cant be compared to Lebron? -
iKingGodGivBiz wrote: »Shizlansky wrote: »En-Fuego22 wrote: »
Westbrook can just posted him up all dayInglewood_B wrote: »Easy way to get everyone on the same page, argument wise, since yall kinda arguing 2 different points.
1 on 1 in their primes, who you got?
I got Westbrook
Like a 3 inch difference in height. It ain't that serious.
And almost 40 pounds and hella aggressive.
So Jordan n Kobe cant be compared to Lebron?
Russ post up small guards all the time.
Kobe and MJ not weak like AI was. -
MJ was a good post defender.
Kobe barely guarded LBJ when they play cuz he's a avwrage post defender. -
Damn this ain't easy PG vs SG both under 6'3.
Iverson's my man cause he was more than basketball with his style and carrying the new black culture on his shoulders BUT I gotta say first thought is Westbrook (27.4ppg 7.1ast 8.3ast) is better. Iverson is underestimated and still doesn't get the respect from critics that he deserves and he was one of the greatest to ever play but Westbrook is already better.
I still remember Iverson getting back to back to back to back to back 50pt games which also was unheard of.
One thing people forget, especially when critiquing ball hogs like Kobe and Iverson, is that the game was DIFFERENT then.
Rant:
You didn't have as many teammates that were capable of stepping their games up all on one team filled with role players. I remember Iverson passing and players missing passes.
Back then (not every team; but the majority of teams in the 90's) you only had one superstar per team if 2 that had to carry the entire load (shooting, passing, coaching on the floor, inspiring teammates, enforcing defense) on their shoulders and the other players weren't even close to the same type of ball play as the superstar. This made for lower shooting percentages and PER because the superstar had to do more because the coach, ownership, the plays and even the other players recognized it was better for the team.
Now, the game has changed (I credit that Chauncey Billups Detroit Pistons team that beat the Lakers which showed that returning to 80's- a team loaded with good players- basketball was better than 90's- a team with only 2 Hall of Fame superstars-basketball) to where teams are built more similar to the 80's NBA teams which are role players and players that are just Better today and more capable of offensively dominating (Kawhi Leonard, Mario Chalmers, Chandler--all players who are the types of players in the 90's would only average 8pts a game, but now these type players are just better athletes capable of converting superstars passes into assists and not turnovers and capable of having 20pt games themselves). Now we have teams with 3 superstars AND unheard of before also have a great surrounding cast even on the bench (Golden State Warriors have Iguodala coming off the bench, Jamal Crawford, Ginobili with the Spurs, Harden used to be with the OKC). I mean bench players that can get 40pts.
Taking that into consideration, I have to see Westbrook playing with another superstar equally as great/if not greater than himself still being able to shine with high numbers as a superstar among great superstars and think to myself this is rare....and better because he has to share the ball with another dominating player and he also has good teammates; and as a point guard (not shooting guard) he also has the responsibility to pass and get other players involved.
Due to the fact he does this (and knowing AI was a SG) at such a high percentage and is getting triple doubles and plays D and motivates his team, and has undergone injuries and has gone to the Finals (like Iverson) I have to put him above AI with respect to AI (I say respect, because AI carried 76ers alone and Westbrook has help) due to who Westbook is playing with and how he still performs.
They're both great man and played in two different types of game eras. Good thread
Sidenote: the comparison would've been the most fair considering when Iverson (Iverson's stats against most opinion were actually damn good) finally got true help in Carmelo, but they truthfully never got to play together. Carmelo was injured for a year and when he returned Iverson was tired from carrying the Nuggets to the playoffs alone without Melo and then the next year AI was traded. If they could've both been in their primes and played years together then the comparison would be more equal with Westbrook and Durant cause it's hard to compare a player that carries a team solo with a player that has ALOT of help.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z30Ztgeso4c
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Focal Point wrote: »SheerExcellence wrote: »I'm amazed you ppl can take a second fiddle who has had a nice six week run and put him ahead of a first ballot hall of famer
Those of you saying Westbrook is much better...Iverson carried a team for years and terrorized the nba, putting fear into every opponents hearts like he was shaq during his peak run
In the 2001 playoffs he put on a show, dropping 40+ and 50 a couple out times as he played lights out ball
Putting up numbers on a historic playoff run is very important, having great Analytics all season its great, but westbrook has not done the post season out of his mind playing yet. Iverson had already done that his fifth year.
If westbrook can keep his current pace up for a full season and an extended playoff run then I will be willing to put him over iverson, but we all know there is no way he can keep this up...he will either get injured or tire himself out.
Lastly, we can't look past the rules changes. Iverson played in a time that was much more physical. Guys were laid out, esp little guards driving the lane. Iverson would routinely get up and keep coming. Westbrook and these current guys, you can't touch em, watch the old iverson highlights and see how much punishment he takes. If iverson played in today's nba where they can't touch you, he might have damn near fifty a night.
Well ? you could say that about Bird, MJ, The Iceman, Pistol Pete, Kareem, Malone, Clyde, The Dream, etc
And all of those guys are better than russ too except maybe clyde -
SheerExcellence wrote: »Focal Point wrote: »SheerExcellence wrote: »I'm amazed you ppl can take a second fiddle who has had a nice six week run and put him ahead of a first ballot hall of famer
Those of you saying Westbrook is much better...Iverson carried a team for years and terrorized the nba, putting fear into every opponents hearts like he was shaq during his peak run
In the 2001 playoffs he put on a show, dropping 40+ and 50 a couple out times as he played lights out ball
Putting up numbers on a historic playoff run is very important, having great Analytics all season its great, but westbrook has not done the post season out of his mind playing yet. Iverson had already done that his fifth year.
If westbrook can keep his current pace up for a full season and an extended playoff run then I will be willing to put him over iverson, but we all know there is no way he can keep this up...he will either get injured or tire himself out.
Lastly, we can't look past the rules changes. Iverson played in a time that was much more physical. Guys were laid out, esp little guards driving the lane. Iverson would routinely get up and keep coming. Westbrook and these current guys, you can't touch em, watch the old iverson highlights and see how much punishment he takes. If iverson played in today's nba where they can't touch you, he might have damn near fifty a night.
Well ? you could say that about Bird, MJ, The Iceman, Pistol Pete, Kareem, Malone, Clyde, The Dream, etc
And all of those guys are better than russ too except maybe clyde
Pete Iceman and Clyde are not better bruh.
All those other players are.
And I'll take Russ over Malone though. -
Damn this ain't easy PG vs SG both under 6'3.
Iverson's my man cause he was more than basketball with his style and carrying the new black culture on his shoulders BUT I gotta say first thought is Westbrook (27.4ppg 7.1ast 8.3ast) is better. Iverson is underestimated and still doesn't get the respect from critics that he deserves and he was one of the greatest to ever play but Westbrook is already better.
I still remember Iverson getting back to back to back to back to back 50pt games which also was unheard of.
One thing people forget, especially when critiquing ball hogs like Kobe and Iverson, is that the game was DIFFERENT then.
Rant:
You didn't have as many teammates that were capable of stepping their games up all on one team filled with role players. I remember Iverson passing and players missing passes.
Back then (not every team; but the majority of teams in the 90's) you only had one superstar per team if 2 that had to carry the entire load (shooting, passing, coaching on the floor, inspiring teammates, enforcing defense) on their shoulders and the other players weren't even close to the same type of ball play as the superstar. This made for lower shooting percentages and PER because the superstar had to do more because the coach, ownership, the plays and even the other players recognized it was better for the team.
Now, the game has changed (I credit that Chauncey Billups Detroit Pistons team that beat the Lakers which showed that returning to 80's- a team loaded with good players- basketball was better than 90's- a team with only 2 Hall of Fame superstars-basketball) to where teams are built more similar to the 80's NBA teams which are role players and players that are just Better today and more capable of offensively dominating (Kawhi Leonard, Mario Chalmers, Chandler--all players who are the types of players in the 90's would only average 8pts a game, but now these type players are just better athletes capable of converting superstars passes into assists and not turnovers and capable of having 20pt games themselves). Now we have teams with 3 superstars AND unheard of before also have a great surrounding cast even on the bench (Golden State Warriors have Iguodala coming off the bench, Jamal Crawford, Ginobili with the Spurs, Harden used to be with the OKC). I mean bench players that can get 40pts.
Taking that into consideration, I have to see Westbrook playing with another superstar equally as great/if not greater than himself still being able to shine with high numbers as a superstar among great superstars and think to myself this is rare....and better because he has to share the ball with another dominating player and he also has good teammates; and as a point guard (not shooting guard) he also has the responsibility to pass and get other players involved.
Due to the fact he does this (and knowing AI was a SG) at such a high percentage and is getting triple doubles and plays D and motivates his team, and has undergone injuries and has gone to the Finals (like Iverson) I have to put him above AI with respect to AI (I say respect, because AI carried 76ers alone and Westbrook has help) due to who Westbook is playing with and how he still performs.
They're both great man and played in two different types of game eras. Good thread
Sidenote: the comparison would've been the most fair considering when Iverson (Iverson's stats against most opinion were actually damn good) finally got true help in Carmelo, but they truthfully never got to play together. Carmelo was injured for a year and when he returned Iverson was tired from carrying the Nuggets to the playoffs alone without Melo and then the next year AI was traded. If they could've both been in their primes and played years together then the comparison would be more equal with Westbrook and Durant cause it's hard to compare a player that carries a team solo with a player that has ALOT of help.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z30Ztgeso4c
You wrote all that for someone to say "Didn't Read" -
I don't think either would do as well if you put them on the other guy's team. I can't see Iverson playing well at all with KD like Westbrook does and I don't see doing as much with as little as AI had.
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For all the MVP talk, Westbrook ain't played but bout 18-20 games w/o KD this year and I'm sure they ain't too much over .500 in those games
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The Lonious Monk wrote: »I don't think either would do as well if you put them on the other guy's team. I can't see Iverson playing well at all with KD like Westbrook does and I don't see doing as much with as little as AI had.
AI had one great year in the terms of winning with that team. Let's not act like they were winning playoff series left and right.
And you can't say Russ wouldn't be winning with that team cuz we will never know but we do know AI didn't bring help his team out the first round with a player similar to how KD okay
And the guard play was no where as good as it it today. -
For all the MVP talk, Westbrook ain't played but bout 18-20 games w/o KD this year and I'm sure they ain't too much over .500 in those games
He was already avg about 25, 8, and 6 WITH kd... -
Winning
